Fishing Economy - Seaweed - Feedback Welcome

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    • Fishing Economy - Seaweed - Feedback Welcome

      Hello Fishing & Cooking Experts,

      I've recently had some time to review the fishing economy and found that Seaweed prices are very high when compared to regular fish.
      The reason for this, I assume, is the Seaweed requirement in Fish Sauce.

      It was never the idea to restrict the amount of Fish Sauce being created by the amount of Seaweed available, so here's what I'd like to change:
      • remove the need for Seaweed in the Fish Sauce recipes
      • double the amount of fish chops needed (that seems like it would keep the fish sauce price constant)
      • add an alternative "Seaweed based" recipe for Fish sauce which requires which requires seaweed to provide a Seaweed sink


      New Recipe structure would be:

      Basic Fish Sauce
      30 Fish Chops
      OR
      15 Fish Chops
      15 Seaweed

      Fancy Fish Sauce
      90 Fish Chops
      OR
      45 Fish Chops
      45 Seaweed

      Special Fish Sauce
      270 Fish Chops
      OR
      135 Fish Chops
      135 Seaweed

      Of course this would massively devalue Seaweed, but this would be fully intentional. Seaweed should be the worst thing you can catch (since you can ALWAYS catch it), and right now its about 15 times more valueable than the most basic fish.

      Keeping it in some of the recipes ensures it retains at least a basic value on the market.


      Looking forward on your thoughts and feedback on this topic!

      - Eltharyon
    • Hi Eltharyon,

      I do not think you will solve the problem of seaweed having a extremely high price. Instead with this option you are moving the problem to the fish / fish chops. If you are looking at the current market capacity of the fish chops (Around 20K on market) and the amount of fish on the market, I think it would lead to a massive increase in price of the fish and fish chops.

      On the other hand it is a good way to kill fishing bots, which is also on of your main focus right?

      People that actualy fish in open world gets more rewards than people fishing on 1 spot.
    • even at half cost of seaweed for a recipe I don't think anyone would use that its much much much easier to get 270 chopped fish than 135 and 135 seaweed

      think the bigger problem is how hard seaweed is to actually fish up and target and the fact u get 0 fame reward discourages people from trying to get it in the first place why stand and hit the same node over and over for 0 fame and maybe a chance at seaweed when I can move around to the fishing hotspot nodes and get fame and tier 8 fish that sell for more
    • all the six seaweed markets are being heavily manipulated, there are significant stockpiles held by several major traders...

      additionally, the price of an item is not a direct indication of its scarcity... I really disagree with making balance changes based on the market price of an item...

      another example of this is the recent discussion on the disproportionately high prices of enchanted T5 resources... the reason their prices are so high is more to do with people being too lazy to gather on the royal island rather than an insufficient supply...

      finally, I think the current fish oil requirements in enchanted cooking recipes and in fact, all cooking recipes are what need to be seriously reviewed...
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      The post was edited 1 time, last by Saya ().

    • Funstealer wrote:

      think the bigger problem is how hard seaweed is to actually fish up and target and the fact u get 0 fame reward discourages people from trying to get it in the first place why stand and hit the same node over and over for 0 fame and maybe a chance at seaweed when I can move around to the fishing hotspot nodes and get fame and tier 8 fish that sell for more
      +1. All-100 cook, and dedicated fisherman here.
      Seaweeds and fish balance is ok, since seaweeds give no fame.
      So usually there is a players choice, to fame fishing with normal profit and journals, or to fish seaweeds for money with zero fame.
      It's seems totally FINE, and balanced.
      It's two different content activity.
      To roam for schools, or to hide somewhere in the tunnel between zones, or to fill time on island during raid form up.
      Seaweed are also serve as option, for a new/poor players to get some money fast and safely.

      I see another problem.
      The amount of fishing time investments (= free market balanced price) into enchanted food.
      Making enchanted food a bit more affordable may fix it.
      And your proposed change will make it less affordable (increase of time investments).
      And kill one of activity options.

      Look, how it's "balanced" now
      Т3 - 300
      Т3.1 - 2 800
      Т5 - 1 000, T3.2 = 7 800 (same stats)
      T5.1 - 8 500
      T7 - 2 500, T5.2 - 26 000 (same stats)
      T7.1 - 27 500
      T7.2 - 77 500
      T7.3 - 227 500

      I recommend you to think about other change, reducing the ammount of time investements into enchanted food.
      To make Something like 5.1 food an option between T5 and T7, to make 7.1 regular food.

      The post was edited 13 times, last by gmatagmis ().

    • As someone who both cooks for my guild and works closely with our guild fishermen,

      I feel that beyond the market manipulation that seems to be going on,

      1) seaweed gives 0 fame. Players looking to level their skill move to a new spot as soon as they start getting seaweed.

      2). It takes too long to reel in. It should be much quicker to pull up something that doesn’t fight back.

      3) as anyone who’s ever fished in RL will tell you seaweed often gets pulled up with whatever fish you are reeling in. Possibly consider adding random seaweed to fish catches so it doesn’t seem so useless.

      4) it doesn’t help fill journals so again fishing for profit or fame means that you move on when you start getting it.

      5) you need 9 seaweed for each Special fish Sauce and 27 of them to craft 1 8.3 Thunderfall Lurcher sandwich. that is 243 Seaweed for one food item.

      I like @gmatagmis suggestion. I think that it would still keep some value in Seaweed, but reduce the need for it in such large quantities.

      As an alternative you could reduce the number of Fish Sauces needed to craft the .1, .2 or .3 food.
      Good luck and Good skill!
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    • @Eltharyon

      To make it, you need to reduce souse recipe prices times 3, and remove seaweeds from basic sauce.

      Basic Fish Sauce
      5 Fish Chops

      Fancy Fish Sauce
      15 Fish Chops
      1 Seaweed

      Special Fish Sauce
      45 Fish Chops
      3 Seaweed

      That also will change seaweeds/chops demand ratio, and lower it's market price.

      Projected result - adequate progression
      Т3 - 300
      Т3.1 - 600 <- "any food" option with fisherman's time investments with no seaweeds.
      Т5 - 1 000, T3.2 = 2 800 (same stats)
      T5.1 - 1 900 <- new economy class option, fishing/farming balance anchor
      T7 - 2 500, T5.2 - 5 000 (same stats)
      T7.1 - 5 200 <- new "regular food", consuming fisherman's time investments with no seaweeds.
      T7.2 - 27 500 <- "middle class food"
      T7.3 - 77 500 <- Elite/GvG food

      The post was edited 5 times, last by gmatagmis ().

    • Another suggestion would be to allow the use of a farmable herb. Currently once you have progressed beyond a certain level in Herbology. (Sorry had to say it) :D There is no use for the t1 and 2 herbs. Allow those to be used in the creation of the fish sauces either as an alternative to seaweed or in combination with seaweed.
      Good luck and Good skill!
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    • @Eltharyon
      Accurate cost price evaluation, based on @MEATCUP suggestion, about progressive seaweed cost, and current prices.
      (Chopped fish 90, Seaweed 1400)

      Basic Fish Sauce
      5 Fish Chops

      Fancy Fish Sauce
      15 Fish Chops
      1 Seaweed

      Special Fish Sauce
      45 Fish Chops
      9 Seaweed

      Projected result on omellettes example
      Т3 - 400
      Т3.1 - 950 <- "any food" option with fisherman's time investments without seaweeds.
      Т5 - 1 200, T3.2 = 3 150 (same stats)
      T5.1 - 2 250 <- new economy class option, fishing/farming balance anchor without seaweeds
      T7 - 3 600, T5.2 - 9 450 (same stats)
      T7.1 - 4 950 <- new "regular food", consuming fisherman's time investments without seaweeds.
      T7.2 - 28 350 <- "middle class" food
      T7.3 - 153 450 <- Elite/GvG food

      Price for seaweeds will go lower, because of demand, but feature with 2 types of fishing activity options, you accidentally have implemented, will stay in game.

      The post was edited 4 times, last by gmatagmis ().

    • This is a great idea. The fish sauce recipe doesn't make sense because of the seaweed. The enchanted recipes don't make sense because of the fish sauce. Worse than not making sense, it isn't fun.

      You could also just make seaweed easier to harvest. Maybe you just get a piece 50-80% of the time you catch anything. It can be stuck to whatever you caught. Similar to how you get worms while harvesting.
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    • MEATCUP wrote:

      Ehhh idk about that @Fujira, that's like saying a 7.2 Greataxe per Gma costs 77K and will expire in 30 minutes after I use it.

      It's not 100% same same
      That's food for ya. You also have to take in to account that the prices are where they are because we players are in control of it. The same way it's silly a 8.3 Excellent Bason goes for 100m+ even tho the cost of the weapon craft is probably around 25-20m? if u manage to get cheap purchases and use focus.
      That's 50+m in profit