Crystal Realm Battles - Share Your Feedback

    • FriendlyFire wrote:

      Bogul wrote:

      Why do I feel like this discussion is pushed toward the "value" of a teritorry so much?
      Apparently people think 5-10 good GvGers in a guild should determine territory control and who wins a season.
      Territories still give passive points, safe access to the best resources in game, and a safe area in the open world. With this change they will give less points passively, but more if you do well in crystal GvGs. Seems pretty valuable.

      Unless this population of this game crashes below 1000 players, GvGs are simply not content the majority of players can participate in. GvGs still determine who gets territory, they are still incredibly important, but actually allowing other members to contribute beyond slave-gathering for gear is a good thing.

      Edit: I'd like to add that alliances should be able to fight each other. Seems similar to hellgates. In the instanced battle, no hard feelings, just fight. Maybe you could make it lowest priority, so alliances only fight if there are no other options. I guess that would only happen if half the teams queued were from one alliance? Maybe this isn't an issue actually.


      Everyone matters, even the crafters and the gathers. This is what we were sold on in the early days. I don't have to be a GvG'er to contribute to my guilds success. I can and should be allowed to do other things, that's the point of a sandbox. Territories =/= Siphoning Mages. Territories give nothing for the effort it takes to obtain them. If it was easy we wouldn't have the huge Anti POE/Anti GvG wave of complainers that we currently have. You can own a territory and get absolutely nothing from it if it's raided for resources and mages camped on spawn. Guards are useless, but finally getting a bit of love. So till then, territories are just another useless chest in the open world.

      Nothing against adding the Crystal GvG's, but the way SBI is implementing them by nerfing territories AGAIN. So yeah, the value of a territory is going to keep coming up.

      At the end of the day, all this is because SBI decided to make Season points worth something without balancing the systems that reward the points in the first place. The best thing SBI can do is Scrap the idea of the Rhino as a season 4 reward and wait till all the new content is released, tested, and balanced before they try to make season points worth something.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by A.Frosted.Wolf: Spelling ().

    • I have so many issues with this system, but I'm not going to rehash what I said on reddit because after thinking about it for a while, there's only one thing I really want to say.

      How many people in this game actually want to do Competitive 5v5s? How many people actually want to do GvGs.

      Now, how many of those people are currently UNABLE to do GvGs due to particular reasons.

      We already have a ton of competitive 5v5 content, a ton of ways for groups to practice together and get synergy to tackle the GvG scene. (Arena, GvG scrims, RHGs). Do we really need MORE content facing towards the top 5% that has a group, time, and want to spend the effort to actually GvG? Crystal GvG in the end is a high level competitive 5v5 content that is locked to TWO time slots. I'm willing to bet you majority of players won't even touch this. Players that want to do 5v5 can simply do RHG, people that want to practice GvG can simply just go scrim.

      The problem with people not doing GvG is much deeper than just not being able to get in, finding the right team is hard, finding synergy between people is difficult. Finding a time slot that everyone can commit to on a daily basis is also hard, Crystal GvG solves none of these problems.

      We need content for the normal players, not for the top 5% hardcore players that want to get into the competitive scene. There are a ton of solo players, small group players, gatherer, crafters that you're neglecting with all these changes.

      You've literally killed small group content from all the mage changes, gathering hasn't been looked at since patch, and the barrier to entry is enormous compared to everything else.

      Crafting is shallow and with the diminishing population gets more boring.

      Solo players have always complained, what happened to that solo content idea you've teased a few month ago? Can we hear more about that?
    • In my point of view this new feature is good but TOO close to the current system.
      It won't encourage new players and gvg beginners to do GVG.

      Evoque wrote:

      players have to be in the cluster of the territory from which they joined the battle during the time window of the territory
      Players should be able to join the match from caerleon or other cities, set are stored in guild island in a "warcamp like chest".
      Players are teleported to a map zone similar to the map they are fighting for without being in the terr like scrim but in "real situation".

      Royal territories should be only Crystal GVG "type".

      Alliance who own territories in BZ can't apply for royal.

      It will let the chance for small guild to get GVG content.

      About the rewards, In addition of full loot pvp, rewards could be :
      • Put a points system.
      • Allow to psend points on in a guild territory if it's a BZ territory, like to upgrade it and make it more difficult to take (Like town plot), that's could help the GVG team on territory.
      • Exchange points for energy to allow small guild to overcharge and compete in BZ.
      • Remove the current rogue mage system. And allow crystal GVG winners to put rogue mages on guild territories.
      • Depending on points also the possibility to buy a immunity ticket for next attack, and not allow attack the territories if the GVG team on territory win or defend successfully.

      Crystal GVG should work in synergy with the current GVG territory not being a "GVG bis"

      The post was edited 5 times, last by Goldorack ().

    • Like others are pointing out all this current iteration of proposed changes does is create more problems.

      Your goal is to get more of the player-base into GvGs and prevent 95% of the world being owned by 2-3 alliances right?

      Continuing to make it even more expensive (overcharge) and less profitable (energy/resources removed) to actually hold or take territory does not incentivize new people to work hard on training up and creating a GvG team to go take them. Why do you think NAPs are worse than they ever were before now? It's the only way successful guilds can continue to remain profitable, they nap with the current existing threats and purge newcomers while holding large swaths of territories to fund this. A new guild without a huge amount of pre-existing funds can not sustain fighting in the black zone vs established guilds if you make it so even if they win the fights every day they run a deficit.

      The way you can actually try to fix this is to make holding a few contested territories more profitable than holding large swaths of them. Making all territories less valuable doesn't accomplish this. Some manner of increased upkeep based on number of owned territories wouldn't work either though because people would just circumvent this with alt guilds. The best way to fix this (imo) is to make it such that guilds owning 10+ terris would actually make more money investing into a few territories and fighting over these more profitable invested territories. This leaves the weaker guilds those territories to fight over. People will always do what is most profitable/efficient so you have to change what that is if you wan't them to do something different.
    • Novan wrote:

      - Timers : this will take place at the same time as warcamps, draining a lot of people from the zvz scene into the crystal realms. I do understand that those might be the hours of maximum people online but that's because of that warcamp ZvZ fight. Draining people from such a important timer ingame is a big mistake since it will just make large scale fights smaller. Move it to 19:00 utc and 4:00 utc or do 4 timers around the clock with the peak of players at NON WARCAMP time.
      They will most likely moved the timers - as stated. Also taking away 5 people from ZvZ (10 from both sides) wouldn't be that bad. We really have to see how many of these Crystal GvG's can be launched simultaneously to see the results.

      Also if I have a GvG coming up in an hour - I might be less likely to attend a Warcamp (depending if I need to do something in RL, so that Im not bothered during a GvG, etc...)

      Novan wrote:

      -Devalating territories AGAIN:
      They are actually adding value to territories - as before in Mercia you could get 336 points per day, and with Crystal GvG you can now get 216+190/240/290 = 406/456/506 points (almost 150% at tower tier3).

      Another added benefit is that you will have a B team of GvG'ers training up. So the benefit is 2-fold, and Im not even talking about other loot + rewards (aside from winning enemy sets)

      tabooshka wrote:

      season points dont give sets
      Winning a Crystal GvG gives points and sets...along side other loot rewards

      A.Frosted.Wolf wrote:

      The prime GvG fight in the game (Caerleon)(City Fights) give nothing compared to other activities.
      City fights give sets and about 30mil Silver/day in taxes as someone in the other thread pointed out (was is someone from BA I reckon?)

      LordSilva wrote:

      Why is the same wasn't done for the mages,
      Mage raiding is getting a "nerf" (or mage defense is getting a "buff") - however you want to view that...

      Filledcake wrote:

      The huge alliances will queue up for crystal GvGs with every territory they own even if they dont have a good team because they know that there is a high chance of not finding an opponent and earning free loot.
      Right, so which one will it be? People crying that territories are being "devalued" or people crying that people get more "free loot" from them? Can't be both...

      Grimhawke-EB wrote:

      That rate per hour is so low that there is even less incentive to waste time defending mages to keep them up. On the flip side, if mages are also dropping much less energy and season points per kill, no one is going to bother killing them.
      Mages (and guards in general) are getting a rework (nerf to raiding, buff to defense).

      Bogul wrote:

      How valuable is "adding content" for more players in the whole equasion compared to reducing percieved value per teritorry.
      Value per territory is being buffed (almost by 150%, point wise, plus other loot rewards) if you are ACTIVELY doing Crystal GvG on it. Which also helps the guild/alliance develop a secondary GvG team. Win-win for everyone?
    • Captainrussia wrote:

      Bogul wrote:

      How valuable is "adding content" for more players in the whole equasion compared to reducing percieved value per teritorry.
      Value per territory is being buffed (almost by 150%, point wise, plus other loot rewards) if you are ACTIVELY doing Crystal GvG on it. Which also helps the guild/alliance develop a secondary GvG team. Win-win for everyone?
      Um, no it's not did you look at the math? Assuming you win roughly half the time (average) at the second difficulty level (again average) you will break even with the passive income from before. At the first difficulty level you could even have an overall winning record and still make less than you did passively before...

      On average it is absolutely less energy than before since people won't be able to always do them and your average expected return rate is what it was before if you win an average amount and do it every single time.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Desriel ().

    • Captainrussia wrote:

      LordSilva wrote:

      Why is the same wasn't done for the mages,
      Mage raiding is getting a "nerf" (or mage defense is getting a "buff") - however you want to view that..
      You comment on the change in the defence and the attack systems, in a situation where I am referring to the assignment of season points only, or you do not understand that?
      The points of the magicians shouldn't be 100% attributed in death of mages, but only 50% or 70%, the remainder being always for the owner of the territory.
    • Kantos wrote:

      The best way to fix this (imo) is to make it such that guilds owning 10+ terris would actually make more money investing into a few territories and fighting over these more profitable invested territories.
      This is the way to go. I've also said this in the past and Snaxxor brought this up in your twitch dev talk. This is a solid way to make more guilds own territories. Create a scaling upkeep cost in owning more and more territories based on how many are in the ALLIANCE (not guild)

      With your added cooldown timer of joining guilds this will not be easily abused. Other ideas is to have it so guilds can invest in defense in the territories - maybe buildings that increase resource gain -> XP in zone -> silver in zone and so forth.
    • Captainrussia wrote:

      A.Frosted.Wolf wrote:

      The prime GvG fight in the game (Caerleon)(City Fights) give nothing compared to other activities.
      City fights give sets and about 30mil Silver/day in taxes as someone in the other thread pointed out (was is someone from BA I reckon?)
      But it doesn't give season points which are more valuable right now. SBI decided to make them the most valuable thing this season by adding a reward at the end of the season without balancing all the systems that generate points in the first place. Castle's are not a GVG, yet give season points, while actual GvG's like city fights do not. Castle's have nothing to do with GvG's anyways, so they shouldn't give season points in the current state but that is going to be for a different topic.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by A.Frosted.Wolf: Spelling and Grammar ().

    • So far the statement i am reading the most is: "Crystal realm gvgs will devalue the territories". This is simply not true, since if you are able to fight at a lvl 3 tower, you will be rewarded with 290 bonus energy, which is 46 less than a mercia territory would give + additionally the territorial reward of atleast 96. The only way territories are devalued is if you hold more territories than you are capable of fighting for. I remember some 3k man alliance leader saying that he has 20 teams to fight for his territories, so now is the time to show that 20 of his territories will sustain a lvl 3 or lvl 2 tower atleast. Removing passive income from the game will neither kill gvg, nor does it harm the game in any way. It only harms territory holders who can hold dozens territories with 1 active team, since now the act of GvG itself is being rewarded. Next step should be removing/reducing / changing silver income for cities, so that you dont have a City gvg once in 2 months, but actually have to play this game to create income.
    • @Evoque

      Does the 'Crystal Team' have to be a different team to the 'Defending Team'?
      So you would need 2 gvg teams per territory to hold and get the additional crystal energy?

      If the same team can fight both, don't you think you are nerfing 18 and 3UTC territories, as they would need two teams to do the job of one team.

      Also this change does not still combat 'Alt team' that assert their dominance on multiple territories, owning a large chunk of watch towers.
    • MSSJ wrote:

      So far the statement i am reading the most is: "Crystal realm gvgs will devalue the territories". This is simply not true, since if you are able to fight at a lvl 3 tower, you will be rewarded with 290 bonus energy, which is 46 less than a mercia territory would give + additionally the territorial reward of atleast 96. The only way territories are devalued is if you hold more territories than you are capable of fighting for. I remember some 3k man alliance leader saying that he has 20 teams to fight for his territories, so now is the time to show that 20 of his territories will sustain a lvl 3 or lvl 2 tower atleast. Removing passive income from the game will neither kill gvg, nor does it harm the game in any way. It only harms territory holders who can hold dozens territories with 1 active team, since now the act of GvG itself is being rewarded. Next step should be removing/reducing / changing silver income for cities, so that you dont have a City gvg once in 2 months, but actually have to play this game to create income.
      The Real GvG team is defending the territory on the real map so it's not lost. They are not the ones who will participate in Crystal GvG's. The aim and audience for Crystal GvG's are the masses not the GvGers. City Fights happen when someone is brave enough to challenge you for it. If no one is brave enough to challenge, then there should NOT be a nerf to anything. You are suggesting nerfing the reward that someone has already worked for and earned because you don't like who earned it.
    • A.Frosted.Wolf wrote:

      The Real GvG team is defending the territory on the real map so it's not lost. They are not the ones who will participate in Crystal GvG's. The aim and audience for Crystal GvG's are the masses not the GvGers. City Fights happen when someone is brave enough to challenge you for it. If no one is brave enough to challenge, then there should NOT be a nerf to anything. You are suggesting nerfing the reward that someone has already worked for and earned because you don't like who earned it.
      you also forgot:
      - 80 8.1+ sets
      - 20 men locked for 24h
      - a solid comp of 20 men with high specs

      most of the guilds can't sustain that, even if they are brave enough.
    • MSSJ wrote:

      So far the statement i am reading the most is: "Crystal realm gvgs will devalue the territories". This is simply not true, since if you are able to fight at a lvl 3 tower, you will be rewarded with 290 bonus energy, which is 46 less than a mercia territory would give + additionally the territorial reward of atleast 96. The only way territories are devalued is if you hold more territories than you are capable of fighting for. I remember some 3k man alliance leader saying that he has 20 teams to fight for his territories, so now is the time to show that 20 of his territories will sustain a lvl 3 or lvl 2 tower atleast.
      Your argument here doesn't really hold up. Yes if you win every single time at the highest level and your teams do it for free and lose zero gear and use no food/pots it doesn't devalue the territory but that is unrealistic and near impossible. If you take the math for average wins assuming you show up every single day it breaks even with what you have right now passively. So on average it does devalue territories because it requires you to field a team that wins at least half the time at the second difficulty level while also costing money and resources each day to fight.

      Using an anglia tower for an example, the 120 energy being removed is worth about 850k. If these are to be treated as actual GvGs just the food/pots likely cost that much let alone gear lost from overcharge. You also have to have a team fight every single day without fail in every territory just to break even with what you had before while assuming these teams not only supply/replace all their own gear, but do it completely for free. The rewards would have to be very substantial for that to be at all enticing.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Desriel ().

    • Since some people can't do maths and think this patch devalues teritories, here's why it doesnt:
      daily income before:
      Mercia 336
      cumbria 288
      anglia 240
      royals 96

      maximum daily income after:
      Mercia 216+290= 506
      cumbria 168+290=458
      anglia 120+290=410
      royals 96+290=386

      Balanced daily income(if you only win on lvl 1 and only every 2nd gvg):
      Mercia 216+95=311
      cumbria 168+95=263
      anglia 120+95=215
      royals 96+95=191

      Doesn't seem so bad now does it. Now consider you have some decent teams and you're atleast where you were before the patch point and energywise.
      Seriously stop complaining. This update isn't supposed to fix the current gvg problems(aka handholding club). It's just supposed to deliver content. And 1 gvg a day for so many people is what i consider content.
      And yes, you will actually have to login to generate wealth now. Sorry.

      *Flies away*

      PS: Maybe have the timers rotate throughout the week, to make it more fair for people with specific schedules(e.g. that can't play 18 utc at all).

      The post was edited 1 time, last by keeperofnature: forgot to put in the PS ().

    • keeperofnature wrote:

      Since some people can't do maths and think this patch devalues teritories, here's why it doesnt:
      daily income before:
      Mercia 336
      cumbria 288
      anglia 240
      royals 96

      maximum daily income after:
      Mercia 216+290= 506
      cumbria 168+290=458
      anglia 120+290=410
      royals 96+290=386

      Balanced daily income(if you only win on lvl 1 and only every 2nd gvg):
      Mercia 216+95=311
      cumbria 168+95=263
      anglia 120+95=215
      royals 96+95=191

      Doesn't seem so bad now does it. Now consider you have some decent teams and you're atleast where you were before the patch point and energywise.
      Seriously stop complaining. This update isn't supposed to fix the current gvg problems(aka handholding club). It's just supposed to deliver content. And 1 gvg a day for so many people is what i consider content.
      And yes, you will actually have to login to generate wealth now. Sorry.

      *Flies away*

      PS: Maybe have the timers rotate throughout the week, to make it more fair for people with specific schedules(e.g. that can't play 18 utc at all).
      You forgot to include cost to gvg, feelsbadman for the small guilds wanting to get territory, not only they have to win the first gvg to get it, then they have to win 2nd one to get anything from the territory
      lets not forget about t8 in open world, cant wait to see that working out

      Balanced daily income, aka fight twice to get rewards of fighting once now - resources

      more energy? welcome to overcharge where your relics trash

      The post was edited 1 time, last by tabooshka ().