PK Immunity

    • I seem to be able to solo the bz with little issue. I have been riding out a bit away from the portals. Its not zergs that bother me. The dgs are as bad as the royal dgs. Run through all mobs without killing them, kill the boss, loot chest, and repeat. Just as dull as chest areas with piles of 10 silver lying all over (really this is yer answer to lack of pve silver on the rc?) the ground. its ok money (75k+ an hour or so) just boring as shit.

      Dieser Beitrag wurde bereits 1 mal editiert, zuletzt von Raithe ()

    • Captainrussia schrieb:

      blappo schrieb:

      Ignoring the problem will cause this game to go the way of all the rest of the PVP centric games.
      Who said there is a problem? And whats wrong with going "the way of all the rest PVP centric games"?!?! This is a PVP centric game - its already headed that way and been heading this way since Alpha.
      Why would anyone try to make it into a mainstream WOW-clone HelloKitty style? Because on equal footing (theme-park MMO) Albion doesnt even stand close to WoW... so why would you want to kill it?

      blappo schrieb:

      Just because PVP is important doesnt mean the rest of the game can be ignored.
      This thread is not about "ignoring" the rest of the game - this thread is about killing the main feature of the game - "Sandbox PVP". Yes I used both terms in the same phrase. If you take PVP out - you end up with a shitty Sandbox...
      capiche?

      blappo schrieb:

      I dont agree with alot in this thread but the mindset you bring will leave the game standing like every other full loot a small cult following but lack of scale to the player base that other MMOs that are more immersive have.
      EvE Online has pretty big "scale"... 500v500 and even more rare but still present 1000v1000 fights (and more).
      20,000 - 30,000 active logged in players at a time on a single shard server.... talk to me about scale again? And at points it peaked at 45,000 simultaneously logged in players...


      I'd much rather play a Sandbox PVP MMO with intricate economy where skill and making choices (and learning how to play - a concept missing from many, many games now) matters, and every choice has a consequence with 10-20k players on a single shard, then 100k + player theme park broken into 20+ servers with no point to the game as there is no loss, no choice, no consequence... just a time sink...
      Eve has a huge huge world. It was completely possible to solo everything on EVE. Much tougher in AO and more costly.
    • RichardManjuice schrieb:

      Eve has a huge huge world. It was completely possible to solo everything on EVE. Much tougher in AO and more costly.
      Eve used to NOT have a huge huge world...around 2003-2005, remember?

      Please stop comparing 12 years of developed video game vs one that has been out for 3 months. You're only doing yourself a disservice. (yes we had beta, apha, pre-alpha, and pre-alpha-alpha, but dont even bother...)

      Also I'd challenge you on the notion of which one is more costly... some PVE (yes PVE only) ships in EVE cost a PLEX, even multiple PLEXes if you factor in modules. That one month, or multiple months worth of gametime!... And Im not even talking about carriers and other capital ships (AO does not have an equivalent.... yet....well maybe mammoth for transport). Sub-capitals can cost this much!

      I dont know of any "soling gear" in AO that costs 2500 gold or 5000 gold... you can solo most shit in t6 or t6.1 which costs like 300k tops (if you dont craft it) and it can cost 20% of that price if you do craft it yourself with focus and laborers...

      so no... I disagree...
      DarthMagus - T8 Stone;
      Mining T8 in enemy WT solo

      Dieser Beitrag wurde bereits 1 mal editiert, zuletzt von Captainrussia ()

    • @Captainrussia
      Oh i have known this man. The following about how much fun that soloing was happened to be my main point. I certainly can do it easily but i do not like those solo dgs at all its quite dull. Now why gatherers are bitching I dunno the gathering is great in bz at non primetime. I just get bored only gathering so I am gather/pve which I have loved in the past in ao. The fixes we get though to pve are just bad ideas. More instances as solo dungeons are removed. Chest areas with crappy silver lying all over that was REALLY boring. This cant be the way.
    • The great thing that does work for pve is the 2man (1 heal 1 dmg or 2 healers as dps) running the 5 man dgs in yellow and blue. 1 grabs a group man2 agros 1 mob only with an auto attack, man 1 resets the rest then runs back and helps kill the 1 mob. This is the only fun pve i can find in this game now. As long as ppl work the pull properly you get great fame and its challenging.
    • Captainrussia schrieb:

      RichardManjuice schrieb:

      Eve has a huge huge world. It was completely possible to solo everything on EVE. Much tougher in AO and more costly.
      Eve used to NOT have a huge huge world...around 2003-2005, remember?
      Please stop comparing 12 years of developed video game vs one that has been out for 3 months. You're only doing yourself a disservice. (yes we had beta, apha, pre-alpha, and pre-alpha-alpha, but dont even bother...)

      Also I'd challenge you on the notion of which one is more costly... some PVE (yes PVE only) ships in EVE cost a PLEX, even multiple PLEXes if you factor in modules. That one month, or multiple months worth of gametime!... And Im not even talking about carriers and other capital ships (AO does not have an equivalent.... yet....well maybe mammoth for transport). Sub-capitals can cost this much!

      I dont know of any "soling gear" in AO that costs 2500 gold or 5000 gold... you can solo most shit in t6 or t6.1 which costs like 300k tops (if you dont craft it) and it can cost 20% of that price if you do craft it yourself with focus and laborers...

      so no... I disagree...
      One solid top end PvE ship could be farmed with one solid, albeit risky, solo run. Always. The ability to amass wealth in EVE was stupid easy. Solo or otherwise.

      Tell me about the solo opportunity to amass that wealth here solo?

      I have 2 fields of T7 ox's and one field of T8. That's like 9 mill every week for me. Making money is easy on AO too, if you played from the start. I was selling carrot soups for 30k day 2 lol. T5 mounts for 200k day 4. I was selling T5 gear at 40k a pop and flat 6 at 80k. That time came and went. It's much harder to establish now. That's the complaint, and it's a valid one. You're insane if you think otherwise.

      I hear what you're saying, I don't agree; I want people to play this game. The current model cannot support an incoming play base. The game will die in short order. Your precious PvP focused game will be empty. Gear costs too much to replace for your average player. I trashed a T7 repair table yesterday because I was 1% overweight. There are people who would have died trying to get that back to Caerleon because they only have 100k to their name and, to me, cheap 5.1 gear. So adjust your perspective a little bit.
    • Raithe schrieb:

      I just get bored only gathering so I am gather/pve which I have loved in the past in ao.
      yup, same, so I added a bit of PVP in there so Im gather/PVE/PVP

      Raithe schrieb:

      Chest areas with crappy silver lying all over that was REALLY boring. This cant be the way.
      I do agree they are not working "to their full potential" - but Im sure they are still gathering feedback (these were added 1 patch ago) and will tweak/adjust as needed to make these small scale PVP "hotspots"

      Raithe schrieb:

      The great thing that does work for pve is the 2man (1 heal 1 dmg or 2 healers as dps) running the 5 man dgs in yellow and blue. 1 grabs a group man2 agros 1 mob only with an auto attack, man 1 resets the rest then runs back and helps kill the 1 mob. This is the only fun pve i can find in this game now. As long as ppl work the pull properly you get great fame and its challenging.
      Yup - Sandbox at its best. You can do the same in BZ, with more fame but risk of getting ganked of course (or maybe resetting some mobs on your enemy and getting their stuff, hehe)

      I hope more stuff like this can be added, especially as the game grows and progresses.
      DarthMagus - T8 Stone;
      Mining T8 in enemy WT solo
    • Captainrussia schrieb:

      Raithe schrieb:

      The great thing that does work for pve is the 2man (1 heal 1 dmg or 2 healers as dps) running the 5 man dgs in yellow and blue. 1 grabs a group man2 agros 1 mob only with an auto attack, man 1 resets the rest then runs back and helps kill the 1 mob. This is the only fun pve i can find in this game now. As long as ppl work the pull properly you get great fame and its challenging.
      Yup - Sandbox at its best. You can do the same in BZ, with more fame but risk of getting ganked of course (or maybe resetting some mobs on your enemy and getting their stuff, hehe)
      I hope more stuff like this can be added, especially as the game grows and progresses.
      EDIT: Nm, pointless to discuss...

      Dieser Beitrag wurde bereits 1 mal editiert, zuletzt von Mardonius ()

    • Neu

      Captainrussia schrieb:

      I cant believe this autistic shit thread is still going on...


      t8 set costs me like 300k to make... but Im also the guy who got called out for "no wai man u cant solo farm t8" - so that's the difference I guess....




      1) This is a PVP game, and PVP is the main driving factor

      2) that means safety already exists, but its in inferior Blue/Yellow zones (and even there Finalhecate managed to make like 50mil+ of silver over 2 months there)...FFS stop being bad

      3) Stop talking out your ass - Eve PVP/PVE is hardcore AF, because you can PVP even in the safe zones.

      4) Did I mention stop being bad? You can PVP or you can chose not to, you can still make shit tons of money or do shit tons of content.

      5) You can do content in BZ and avoid PVP - stop being bad.

      6) Stop being bad - did I forget to mention this?

      Stop being scrubs and stop crying. Adapt or die... or go play WoW or HelloKittyOnline



      Yours,

      - Bad ass gatherer who likes balance and understands the game


      But I got banned from Hello Kitty Online, I was to hardcore for it. XD P.S. I agree with ya.
    • Neu

      RichardManjuice schrieb:

      Gear costs too much to replace for your average player.
      Really don't understand this AT ALL. On a good night I have roughly 2h to play. I have been able to afford and keep myself in flat gear of my highest tier since day 1. When I am low on cash I do things to earn a little more. Once I harvested a bunch of T1 logs on my island because I saw they sell for a decent price and require no gathering skill.

      There are sooooo many opportunities for people to make money via the market, the black market, personal islands, silver territories, gathering, etc. If people are unable to make enough money to support 4.1 or flat 5 gear I don't think it's because the market is too difficult to enter, it's because they're lazy/unwilling/don't understand how.

      I'll even go so far as to argue that people don't need any higher gear than at the moment as there is plenty to do in 4.1/flat 5. I can wear T7, but I still roll around in flat 5 or flat 6 because it's what I can afford and the benefits of wearing 7+ just don't outweigh the cost or the risk. Granted I'm also not doing GvG or R/B HGs, but neither is some noob that doesn't have any money. The beauty of the whole system is that players who just started can jump in, get to T5 and be within 9% effectiveness of the 'average' player (I'd wager that the average player is only T6 at the moment and likely wearing 4.1/5 still).

      Yes older players are going to have mountains of wealth that allow them to wear higher tier gear and buy endless supplies of it, but ultimately that doesn't prevent new players from catching up skill wise. Money is not power in the absolute sense. It buys gear of a higher power level, but it doesn't win fights on it's own, nor does it prevent others from being good at the game or making an impact.
    • Neu

      Vyle schrieb:

      RichardManjuice schrieb:

      Gear costs too much to replace for your average player.
      Really don't understand this AT ALL. On a good night I have roughly 2h to play. I have been able to afford and keep myself in flat gear of my highest tier since day 1. When I am low on cash I do things to earn a little more. Once I harvested a bunch of T1 logs on my island because I saw they sell for a decent price and require no gathering skill.
      There are sooooo many opportunities for people to make money via the market, the black market, personal islands, silver territories, gathering, etc. If people are unable to make enough money to support 4.1 or flat 5 gear I don't think it's because the market is too difficult to enter, it's because they're lazy/unwilling/don't understand how.

      I'll even go so far as to argue that people don't need any higher gear than at the moment as there is plenty to do in 4.1/flat 5. I can wear T7, but I still roll around in flat 5 or flat 6 because it's what I can afford and the benefits of wearing 7+ just don't outweigh the cost or the risk. Granted I'm also not doing GvG or R/B HGs, but neither is some noob that doesn't have any money. The beauty of the whole system is that players who just started can jump in, get to T5 and be within 9% effectiveness of the 'average' player (I'd wager that the average player is only T6 at the moment and likely wearing 4.1/5 still).

      Yes older players are going to have mountains of wealth that allow them to wear higher tier gear and buy endless supplies of it, but ultimately that doesn't prevent new players from catching up skill wise. Money is not power in the absolute sense. It buys gear of a higher power level, but it doesn't win fights on it's own, nor does it prevent others from being good at the game or making an impact.
      I don't consider 4.1 to be basic gear to be successful. It's shit gear. However, you're correct that it is cheap.

      I can melt an entire group of player with my W and E in 4.1 with lower masteries.
    • Neu

      Raithe schrieb:

      not that I use 4.1 but.......confused. if 4.1 is shit gear how are you melting an entire group?
      I think he's suggesting that they're wearing 4.1, not him. Regardless my point still stands. 4.1 is sufficient for fame farming, making more silver, etc. You are absolutely correct that new players can't walk into the game and afford themselves full T7 to run around in all the time. That doesn't prevent them from doing any of the tasks that'll get them there. Nothing is preventing them from using the "shit gear" to afford higher tier gear down the road.

      Essentially your argument is that progress takes effort. You are correct, progress does take effort.

      Even if you actually can nuke a group of people wearing 4.1 using two skills, there are more factors to gameplay beyond just your abilities. Why are the standing in a group? Why are they standing still? Are they not using any skills to mitigate or disrupt your damage? Where is this fight happening? Are they in a black zone dungeon or the yellow zone where it doesn't actually matter and your T7 gear is actually soft capped anyway?

      My point in all of this is that new players can get to a level where they are sufficiently able to do fun and useful things to further bootstrap themselves at very low cost.
    • Neu

      Vyle schrieb:

      Raithe schrieb:

      not that I use 4.1 but.......confused. if 4.1 is shit gear how are you melting an entire group?
      I think he's suggesting that they're wearing 4.1, not him. Regardless my point still stands. 4.1 is sufficient for fame farming, making more silver, etc. You are absolutely correct that new players can't walk into the game and afford themselves full T7 to run around in all the time. That doesn't prevent them from doing any of the tasks that'll get them there. Nothing is preventing them from using the "shit gear" to afford higher tier gear down the road.
      Essentially your argument is that progress takes effort. You are correct, progress does take effort.

      Even if you actually can nuke a group of people wearing 4.1 using two skills, there are more factors to gameplay beyond just your abilities. Why are the standing in a group? Why are they standing still? Are they not using any skills to mitigate or disrupt your damage? Where is this fight happening? Are they in a black zone dungeon or the yellow zone where it doesn't actually matter and your T7 gear is actually soft capped anyway?

      My point in all of this is that new players can get to a level where they are sufficiently able to do fun and useful things to further bootstrap themselves at very low cost.
      I mean, stun and compress + low gear = game over. The damage mitigation just isn't there.

      Aside from that, 7.2+ shouldn't cost 2M a set in a full loot PvP game. That's a truly idiotic mechanic. I make 9-18M a week. That cost is nothing to me. Most people do not.

      Other full loot games had mechanics for shit players in shit anything the ability to amass wealth with some risk even solo. Tell me where players in 4.1 have the opportunity to make 2M cheddar solo in 4.1 gear ( aside from a skilled healer)

      Dieser Beitrag wurde bereits 1 mal editiert, zuletzt von RichardManjuice ()

    • Neu

      I think we're arguing different points here. My point is and has been that 4.1 is cheap enough and sufficient enough to make progress in this game. Using that gear players are able to fame farm and collect more silver to buy better gear.

      What you seem to be arguing is that they can't easily afford 7.2 gear, or that 7.2 is too expensive. First, given that the vast majority of players are not wearing 7.2 gear I don't think this really matters. If you're talking about new players being competitive, you can't look at yourself (a self admitted outlier) and say that the game is imbalanced. When the majority of players are using T5/T6 then 4.1 puts someone slightly behind average (not even on item power necessarily, but on selectable skills).

      What is the 7.2 needed for anyway? What activities are you doing that necessitate that gear? More importantly, what activities are a new player (that likely can't even wear 7.2 gear) doing that necessitates that gear? I can't think of anything other than a GvG that necessitates it right now.

      Furthermore you're completely neglecting the economic aspect of all of this. When I started playing around launch 4.1 gear was too expensive for me. It dropped in price. I started using 4.1 when it became more viable. When T5 became competitive price wise I started preferring it as it opened additional skill options for me. Now T6 is dropping to the point where it is also "cheap" and thus I opt for it more often than not. As players progress and people gather more resources the prices will fall and people will wear higher tier items. This game hasn't been out long enough to assume the economy has stabilized yet, so perhaps one day 7.2 will be the norm.
    • Neu

      Vyle schrieb:

      There are sooooo many opportunities for people to make money via the market, the black market, personal islands, silver territories, gathering, etc. If people are unable to make enough money to support 4.1 or flat 5 gear I don't think it's because the market is too difficult to enter, it's because they're lazy/unwilling/don't understand how.
      but its so much easier to just cry and complain instead of research and observe and ask questions on how to get better ;)
      DarthMagus - T8 Stone;
      Mining T8 in enemy WT solo
    • Neu

      Vyle schrieb:

      I think we're arguing different points here. My point is and has been that 4.1 is cheap enough and sufficient enough to make progress in this game. Using that gear players are able to fame farm and collect more silver to buy better gear.

      What you seem to be arguing is that they can't easily afford 7.2 gear, or that 7.2 is too expensive. First, given that the vast majority of players are not wearing 7.2 gear I don't think this really matters. If you're talking about new players being competitive, you can't look at yourself (a self admitted outlier) and say that the game is imbalanced. When the majority of players are using T5/T6 then 4.1 puts someone slightly behind average (not even on item power necessarily, but on selectable skills).

      What is the 7.2 needed for anyway? What activities are you doing that necessitate that gear? More importantly, what activities are a new player (that likely can't even wear 7.2 gear) doing that necessitates that gear? I can't think of anything other than a GvG that necessitates it right now.

      Furthermore you're completely neglecting the economic aspect of all of this. When I started playing around launch 4.1 gear was too expensive for me. It dropped in price. I started using 4.1 when it became more viable. When T5 became competitive price wise I started preferring it as it opened additional skill options for me. Now T6 is dropping to the point where it is also "cheap" and thus I opt for it more often than not. As players progress and people gather more resources the prices will fall and people will wear higher tier items. This game hasn't been out long enough to assume the economy has stabilized yet, so perhaps one day 7.2 will be the norm.
      I get what you're saying. For the most part I agree. I think those who started early had it easy in terms of making money. Our wealth was obtained easier. I was selling carrot soups for 5-20k per for the first 2 weeks. T3 mounts at 30k. So for me to expand rapidly was easy mode. I used my money to buy mats and sell the crafted gear at a high rate of return. All the way to T6. That option is gone now. Using 4K focus I craft my entire set at 6.1 and it costs me 85k where it would normally cost 220k.

      Shit, my Martlock plot made me 65M, I sold it before the bubble popped and made even more.

      That being said, I was out of 4.1 quickly and had success enough to keep me going. Now life is easy mode for me. People now don't see that quick progression. So they grow frustrated. It took me 3 months to have a lasting establishment in the game. End game crafting T8 in 6 items, full plots of T7 and T8 mounts and near 100 masteries on my PvP char. New players will never see that progression unless they pay into the game. That's not right.
    • Neu

      RichardManjuice schrieb:

      I think those who started early had it easy in terms of making money. Our wealth was obtained easier.
      I ran a t4 expedition (first one that is unlocked) that made me 2000 Gold (4k silver payout, flipped into gold at 1:2 ratio), that was within 30 min of game launch and servers being up on Day1. I've never ran another expedition since then...

      RichardManjuice schrieb:

      New players will never see that progression unless they pay into the game. That's not right.
      Well, not fully agree here...some of my PVP masteris are still like 1/100 or 10/100 - so Im still somewhat of a "new player" in that regard, of course I possess the silver/gold/infrastructure of a t8 gatherer and PVE/market/PVP knowledge that comes with that...

      But going back to red zones (or low BZ Anglia) in 4.1 gear to level sets - makes me feel like Im a "noob" all over again ;)
      DarthMagus - T8 Stone;
      Mining T8 in enemy WT solo
    • Neu

      RichardManjuice schrieb:

      End game crafting T8 in 6 items, full plots of T7 and T8 mounts and near 100 masteries on my PvP char. New players will never see that progression unless they pay into the game. That's not right.
      I think that is where we're disagreeing then. I don't know that it's necessary for anyone to have all of that. I don't have that and I don't think that my enjoyment of the game is in any way diminished. I feel capable of competing with other players, and I'm not upset that I'm not ultra wealthy. I'm just now starting to hit T8 potion crafting, and hit T8 herb growing some time last week. I'm stoked on it even though there are people who got there before me.

      I don't think that people will have to pay into the game, I just think the progression will be much slower. That's what this whole discussion has been about for me, that my enjoyment (and other people's enjoyment) of the game isn't hampered by the fact that it's not as easy as it was for you. I'd love to be in your place, but I don't need to be. Similarly, had you not gotten to where you are so fast I'm not sure that you would think you were in such a bad place either. Hindsight is 20/20, and you being in this position of wealth are looking back thinking "shit, I couldn't do this if I started now", but you also would never know what it was like to be in that spot in the first place.

      Side note, I really love how this conversation has evolved. My understanding of your issues here has shifted from thinking you were advocating for everyone wearing high tier gear to believing that you had a fun and rewarding experience early on and want others to have the same fun and rewarding experience. Luckily most of us don't know what we missed out on, or else we may be saltier that we're not in your rich man power club. ;)