# Cursed mage on death row?

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• ### Niekas wrote:

Yes. The stacks go towards the applier.
if you ( the curse mage) applies Q stacks on an enemy, does an ally's attack with grudge stack curse separately, like how two curse staff user would stack it separately and consumes their own stack (means single hand curse in this case) or together with yours? if you use something like merc jacket, does the curse application from an ally proc it? does the curse damage applied by an ally be amplified by your armor damage bonus, or it will be amplified by their own armor status?

havent tested it out on test server but there are many question i have towards this skill xd

### Niekas wrote:

Yes. The stacks go towards the applier.
if you ( the curse mage) applies Q stacks on an enemy, does an ally's attack with grudge stack curse separately, like how two curse staff user would stack it separately and consumes their own stack (means single hand curse in this case) or together with yours? if you use something like merc jacket, does the curse application from an ally proc it? does the curse damage applied by an ally be amplified by your armor damage bonus, or it will be amplified by their own armor status?
havent tested it out on test server but there are many question i have towards this skill xd
No the stacks do not multiply, however, there is no difference mathematically once 4 stacks are reached since every re-apply procs the 4th stack. Meaning if you and the other guy hit the same target, with every attack you re-apply and proc the 4th stack, same would happen even if you multiplied them.
• ### Niekas wrote:

No the stacks do not multiply, however, there is no difference mathematically once 4 stacks are reached since every re-apply procs the 4th stack. Meaning if you and the other guy hit the same target, with every attack you re-apply and proc the 4th stack, same would happen even if you multiplied them.
as you said the so damage return skills i.e infernal shield will return damage to the applyer, but since there will be no multiple stacks of curse on the target from grudge, the damage returned goes towards the last person that applied the curse, can i assume that? then if thats the case, curse isnt going to be underpowered as this thread stated, since you can just cast grudge on your tank and let him reapply the 4th stack and let him take all the damage returns?... again i am just assuming things, havent test it out yet
• ### Frankasti wrote:

My questions; Why should I continue playing the Cursed staff? What will be its utility if the proposed changes go through? Am I being overly negative because my class is getting a massive nerf?
Easy: Life-Curse.

But yes, I'm also a big fan of Cursed and like in the beginning of Beta 2 we are back in the dumpers.

Just hope they buff it soon. I am not willing to switch Staffs again. I was never a fan of fire staff and there are too many frost staff players at the moment.

Id rather switch too claymore but the feeling is not the same.
• Reflect is fine and a hard counter to the current 5v5 meta which is to simply burst a single target down using curse beam (always), purge against nature and displacement with fling and stickies. Generally the target is a tank or bruiser (the builds with reflect). This is actually a very good game mechanic if you have pvped outside of duels.

The post was edited 1 time, last by Sixunder ().

• You'll have to watch out for spears though. The 80% reflect they have has 40% uptime.. So take note, if you see a spear don't just decide to blow him up.

### Niekas wrote:

No the stacks do not multiply, however, there is no difference mathematically once 4 stacks are reached since every re-apply procs the 4th stack. Meaning if you and the other guy hit the same target, with every attack you re-apply and proc the 4th stack, same would happen even if you multiplied them.
as you said the so damage return skills i.e infernal shield will return damage to the applyer, but since there will be no multiple stacks of curse on the target from grudge, the damage returned goes towards the last person that applied the curse, can i assume that? then if thats the case, curse isnt going to be underpowered as this thread stated, since you can just cast grudge on your tank and let him reapply the 4th stack and let him take all the damage returns?... again i am just assuming things, havent test it out yet
No, the Curse user will receive the damage. But assuming the tank is hitting someone like healer or cloth user with no reflects, thats a win since the damage given scales of the Cursed one.

Curse is super-op at the moment and will/should receive nerfs. Myself alone am getting 20+ kills early every SoloQ in Arena.
• The only thing that is odd is this new "W" ability. It seems they want to push Curse to be Support even though Curse players can dish out a lot of damage sumetimes.
• you can cast it on yourself though, and quickly get to 4 stacks or more if multiple targets
• ### archymede wrote:

you can cast it on yourself though, and quickly get to 4 stacks or more if multiple targets
Mmmh. Attack speed Cursed Sounds like a plan.

### archymede wrote:

you can cast it on yourself though, and quickly get to 4 stacks or more if multiple targets
Mmmh. Attack speed Cursed Sounds like a plan.
This is exactly what it currently is. Stuff melts like woaaah.
• I wonder if you can build a open world battle Mage now with this new ability.
FYI: Yes I am upset for the nerves, but Im looking for alternatives to still use it. (when there is a will there is a way.)
• ### Dethcord wrote:

Reflects absolutely destroy any burst damage centered build. The glass cannon type. Of course it's not everything that's wrong with reflects but this one point is enough to remove them, and is obvious and easily observable.
Have you considered (and Im not trolling - a serious question here) that potentially reflect is the hard counter to the glass cannon gameplay? I mean every class kind of has a hard counter (be that another class, or a combination of items/spells), right?

### kisukin wrote:

Im curious now , what happen if you active a reflect and take reflected damage ?
^ That. And does resistance potion affect reflected damage? (decrease it)? So the defensive counter to reflect would be do pop resistance pot when your fully stacked target uses reflect?
• Currently playing attack speed stacked curse Mage with lifecurse and torch with full leather passives to attack speed . Stacking w vile curse off autos to max in 2 seconds , actually quite fun I will admit after being very negative about it myself. however still think armour piercer would be preferred by group . Have to wait and see what happens with meta
• ### Wretch wrote:

Currently playing attack speed stacked curse Mage with lifecurse and torch with full leather passives to attack speed . Stacking w vile curse off autos to max in 2 seconds , actually quite fun I will admit after being very negative about it myself. however still think armour piercer would be preferred by group . Have to wait and see what happens with meta
indeed this is hella fun. You need to run cloth for the bomb, but leather is fine for lifecurse. Groups can adapt, and piercer is over rated, plus nerfed by all means including size of it.
• ### Niekas wrote:

indeed this is hella fun. You need to run cloth for the bomb, but leather is fine for lifecurse. Groups can adapt, and piercer is over rated, plus nerfed by all means including size of it.
So Grudge + Enfeeble blades on the tank or a dagger DPS = GG?

New meta to make dagger viable in 5v5?

### Dethcord wrote:

Reflects absolutely destroy any burst damage centered build. The glass cannon type. Of course it's not everything that's wrong with reflects but this one point is enough to remove them, and is obvious and easily observable.
Have you considered (and Im not trolling - a serious question here) that potentially reflect is the hard counter to the glass cannon gameplay? I mean every class kind of has a hard counter (be that another class, or a combination of items/spells), right?

### kisukin wrote:

Im curious now , what happen if you active a reflect and take reflected damage ?
^ That. And does resistance potion affect reflected damage? (decrease it)? So the defensive counter to reflect would be do pop resistance pot when your fully stacked target uses reflect?
1. Not everything has a hard counter. Fotm spear builds don't have a hard counter, fotm cursed staff builds don't have a hard counter, and many more. Some builds are hard to beat, but more often than not not impossible. For reflect however, if you're a leather wearing guy and you encounter a cloth player - you use retaliate and it reflects damage before reductions (!), and increases your resistances aswell. Which means that you'll hit yourself much harder than the enemy, and if you rely on straight damage as your main power - than you have no options. You either kill yourself, or stop attacking and get killed while you're waiting for retaliate to be over. You just press one button and any heavy damage cloth build is destroyed. It's way too easy and it should not be that way. If anything, reflects should be made to deal damage after resistances, for starters, but it's still a cancerous mechanic.

A couple of days before the patch I switched ambush for inferno shield in my build and I feel much better now because I live longer and deal more damage in most situations because of damage reflect. And I'm still running mage cowl, but hunter hood after this patch is way good to pass, so I may probably switch to this. I'm not only whining about reflects because I lose to them (sometimes I do, sometimes I don't), but also because I feel like I'm being forced to use certain items because they work so much better than others.

2. Resistance potions do reduce reflected damage. But retaliate itself, as well as inferno shield, increase resistances aswell, so you'll hit yourself and your target for about the same damage at best, and gigantify would work better for this I'm pretty sure

### Niekas wrote:

indeed this is hella fun. You need to run cloth for the bomb, but leather is fine for lifecurse. Groups can adapt, and piercer is over rated, plus nerfed by all means including size of it.
So Grudge + Enfeeble blades on the tank or a dagger DPS = GG?
New meta to make dagger viable in 5v5?
correct. You can basically summon a second vile caster on a front liner to deal damage for 6 seconds, each 11ish (meaning actual 5 sec CD). In fact getting it on more AA class like axe/spear is more efficient