Gvg locking system, discussion thread.

  • Doesn't make sense that GvG is only available for less than 1% of the population.. an alliance with 1k players, or even 10k players.. has only 5 guys who use this content that the developers spent a lot of time making..
    So if locking a team forces their guild/alliance to form another group, that really makes sense..
    I know derrik and all the GvG players wont like it.. but its something that has to happen.. you cant keep the top content of the game away from the whole playerbase..

    Just imagine if WoW made Raids only available to 1% of the population!!! (oh wait! they did long time ago!)
    So yeah.. Blizzard realized their mistake and make raiding available to everyone.. even my 4 year son did some raiding (Im not exaggerating, he has 905ilvl right now)

    TLDR: Make GvG available to more players..
  • We are using 8.1 with same item power as the other top teams, we are not unbeatable, just play better and make adjustments and other teams can easily at least come close to beating us. You should challenge yourselves, not ask for gvg mechanics to change instead. Just my opinion. We have been enjoying the fights
    You can't explain chess moves to Pokémon GO players
  • I kinda support this thread, but issue here i see that TOP teams you mentioned is formed through all betas and stayed like that and nothing new or even anything new will form if whole current gvg/hg design wont be overlooked.

    From my personal practice i can say that in Beta1 i had couple teams which could follow up to the end continent if only game was released back than. Also beta1 had full acceses to easily create a nice solid team from fresh/new players, form em up and push forward in a progressive way and change some stuff in the end where you sit now guys. That was because anyone could try anyone mattered not the 1% from whole players as it is now.

    Now (in guild i play) we have active 40+(which drops down everyday was 50+ last week) new players which some of them have descent experience in mobas and only follows 5v5 in this game, but start points here is completely dull and me veteran(a casual by time play ) and couple of others who still stick at this game from beta1 see how possibility to even setup or and train random/different players into solid 5v5 requires A BLOODY HARD time/motivation/social investments, because whole play here is in unrestricted and with shitty expierence/practice/demotivation there will be mostly zero amount of new powers to grow up.

    No1 loves to get snowballed to see the real 5v5 play and this arent creating any goal to try out (every day) to farm gear and stick in the game. And Funny part here that whole ROAD MAP thread has almost nothing about this issue i mentioned here so it will be soon simple “HF playing in 300 guild which supports 5 man army for another couple months” how you keep motivated 295 players there @Derrick or @nilfs or @FuS well it doesnt matter i guess and GL :)

    The post was edited 3 times, last by Dragis ().

  • Dragis wrote:

    I kinda support this thread, but issue here i see that TOP teams you mentioned is formed through all betas and stayed like that and nothing new or even anything new will form if whole current gvg/hg design wont be overlooked.

    From my personal practice i can say that in Beta1 i had couple teams which could follow up to the end continent if only game was released back than. Also beta1 had full acceses to easily create a nice solid team from fresh/new players, form em up and push forward in a progressive way and change some stuff in the end where you sit now guys. That was because anyone could try anyone mattered not the 1% from whole players as it is now.

    Now (in guild i play) we have active 40+(which drops down everyday was 50+ last week) new players which some of them have descent experience in mobas and only follows 5v5 in this game, but start points here is completely dull and me veteran(a casual by time play ) and couple of others who still stick at this game from beta1 see how possibility to even setup or and train random/different players into solid 5v5 requires A BLOODY HARD time/motivation/social investments, because whole play here is in unrestricted and with shitty expierence/practice/demotivation there will be mostly zero amount of new powers to grow up.

    No1 loves to get snowballed to see the real 5v5 play and this arent creating any goal to try out (every day) to farm gear and stick in the game. And Funny part here that whole ROAD MAP thread has almost nothing about this issue i mentioned here so it will be soon simple “HF playing in 300 guild which supports 5 man army for another couple months” how you keep motivated 295 players there @Derrick or @nilfs or @FuS ah whatever GL :)

    Incoherent rambling here. If people aren't motivated or trying then they won't be the best, it's the same everywhere.

    Create a team with a core 2/3 and build around it. Replace people as necessary. It's not that difficult to actually make a team. People just have to accept that they probably won't be the best, not everyone can be.
    Derrick
  • Taters wrote:

    Easiest way to prevent the dominant strength of a single team without playing with mumbo jumbo numbers?

    Mine territory.
    Essence territory.
    Dungeon territory.

    Diverse layouts lead to diverse team comps, take strength away from a single strong team in these days of tdm rush mid.

    Bring them back.
    This right here, im of the same opinion. More diverse gvgs leads to not having to watch the same 5 motherfuckers, with the same fucking comp, fight with the same tactics over and over. Shit is starting to make my eyes bleed...
  • I don't think anyone's arguing the fact that a good team should yield good profit for the guild/alliance. Most people are arguing that a good team shouldn't yield EVERYthing, that one team shouldn't be enough. Even if someone wins everywhere they fight, they should not be able to fight everywhere.

    As to the @Dragis's post, I think he does have a point. On top of the specialization grind and the gear grind, there's a distinct Albion PVP/Team experience grind that potential new teams have to go through. Even if you only use alpha/beta 1 veterans (a lot of which have probably quit by now). it still takes a lot of time for them to form up into a working team. Thinking of someone new to the game and the difference in terms of practical experience is massive. Any one of the grinds by themselves are ok, but put them all together and it's pretty unlikely anyone would bother. It's simply not worth the time investment vs doing other things/other games. Look at it this way, if making a top competitive team would not be difficult, there'd be plenty of them around.

    Feeling that they can chip at the big guys would probably improve motivation to play, desire to form alliances, make for a better and more active environment all around. Are there workarounds and things that can be done with the current system? Yes. Will most people jump through all the hops to do it? Not likely. But at the end of the day I think we all want a lot of active people actively engaged in PVP of all kinds.

    If you can agree that one team ahead of the curve (pvp xp, etc) shouldn't be able to do EVERYthing, then it's just down to the solution specifics. What OP suggest sounds reasonable enough.
  • I mean of course Derrick is ok with the way the system is now.

    Honestly, they all have 2 alts ready to go, regardless of locks. The only way to siege them is with territories that go live at the exact same time. And a coordinated drop.

    But, I think the lock mechanics should be fixed to what it was supposed to be.
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  • Specializations is the real issue. The time it takes to go from 0-60 specialization points is insane, would take over a week of non-stop farm farming. so re-rolling is virtually non-existent. There are plenty of newly formed 5v5 teams, but when they are behind 50+ specialization points, even on equal gear they stand little chance.

    These guys deserve to be the best because realistically they have put in the most time. The gap in this game however is much harder to fill due to the necessity of grinding spec points.

    The post was edited 1 time, last by Xilez ().

  • I mean I respect what Derrick and his guys did, but, I have a full time job. I still played a lot after missing the first 2 weeks. And CV is highly contested. They formed a giant alliance, used a safety blanket, and sat in CV.

    They noticed their comp was shit without a glaive, after losing to Fus repeatedly, powergrinded whated and got him on a glaive, then started winning.

    A large part of this game is economy, zerging to hold down stuff, etc.

    But, I think even they can agree, specializations matter too much, and take too long to grind. I'm also sure they would prefer better fights, outspeccing everyone they fight. (Other than Nilfs team and a couple others)
    BoM, In our hearts and minds.
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  • Gensuru wrote:

    So then. Two aggressors on opposite borders from moneyguild will make a pact.

    On day 1, they both launch attacks. The first to go has one simple objective, get a single kill. Then, give up the battle.
    Now for the 2nd gvg, the other member guild of this pact gets to fight an easier team.

    Repeat daily.

    Clearly Maybe, maybe not less problematic than what you describe for now. But, I wanted to point out, that no matter what little tweak you make, the next most exploitive thing will become the norm immediately. And, this next thing must be considered carefully before realizing exactly what kind of an impact the change will have.
    Yes. 5 guys shouldn't be the only ones skilled enough to hold 10 territories.
  • JonahVeil wrote:

    I mean I respect what Derrick and his guys did, but, I have a full time job. I still played a lot after missing the first 2 weeks. And CV is highly contested. They formed a giant alliance, used a safety blanket, and sat in CV.

    They noticed their comp was shit without a glaive, after losing to Fus repeatedly, powergrinded whated and got him on a glaive, then started winning.

    A large part of this game is economy, zerging to hold down stuff, etc.

    But, I think even they can agree, specializations matter too much, and take too long to grind. I'm also sure they would prefer better fights, outspeccing everyone they fight. (Other than Nilfs team and a couple others)
    Tea Party (Fallenstarz and Talagul team) free farmed cv for first two weeks of the game, evaniskus team 2 weeks after that. We fame farmed the hard way, with bigger groups most of the time.

    We beat Fus team without glaive 3 times before they beat us.

    Whated can't even wear t8 glaive dude.

    We are on similar item power with most of the teams we have been fighting, as you can look up yourself in vids etc.
    You can't explain chess moves to Pokémon GO players
  • KingMoJo wrote:

    JonahVeil wrote:

    I mean I respect what Derrick and his guys did, but, I have a full time job. I still played a lot after missing the first 2 weeks. And CV is highly contested. They formed a giant alliance, used a safety blanket, and sat in CV.

    They noticed their comp was shit without a glaive, after losing to Fus repeatedly, powergrinded whated and got him on a glaive, then started winning.

    A large part of this game is economy, zerging to hold down stuff, etc.

    But, I think even they can agree, specializations matter too much, and take too long to grind. I'm also sure they would prefer better fights, outspeccing everyone they fight. (Other than Nilfs team and a couple others)
    Tea Party (Fallenstarz and Talagul team) free farmed cv for first two weeks of the game, evaniskus team 2 weeks after that. We fame farmed the hard way, with bigger groups most of the time.
    We beat Fus team without glaive 3 times before they beat us.

    Whated can't even wear t8 glaive dude.

    We are on similar item power with most of the teams we have been fighting, as you can look up yourself in vids etc.
    Once Fus's team adjusted you guys did not beat them until switching to glaive.

    No need to defend yourself, looks bad tbh.

    And no offense to Nilfgaard, but their "A" team, is complete and utter dogshit. So ya, maybe their fame is equivalent, but those guys are playing like husks lately.
    BoM, In our hearts and minds.
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  • We do also think that "force projection" of individual teams are too much of a problem, as are no shows.

    We are internally discussing a concept that would change how territory tagging works.

    The basic principle is that you pick the place where you are "stationed" first, before attacks are revealed, and not the other way around as it is right now.

    In very simplified terms, here is how a "GvG day" would look like
    • All players pick the territory you want to be garrisoned in. (you can freely change your garrison every day)
    • If you are garrisoned in a territory, you can take part in attacks declared from that territory, and you can defend attacks against that territory
    • Guilds declare their attacks. However, these attacks are not yet revealed to to other guilds
    • All attacks are revealed. Potential attacking players are also revealed (i.e. all players garrisoned in the territory from which the attack is coming - this will take the bite out of no shows). It is now too late to change your garrison in time to react to these particular attacks
    • Attacks / counter-attacks / retaliate attacks are fought
    • If a territory is conquered, all players in the winning team immediately move their garrison there
    • If the territory you are garrisoned in gets conquered, you'll lose your garrison there.
    • GvG day ends. Go back to the top.
    Now, the details are of course more complex due to varying peak times etc, but the above gets the point across.

    What would the impact of this be?
    • On offense, a particular GvG team can still attack everyone, and easily change their attack locations from day to day
    • On defense, you can only defend against an attack with players that have been garrisoned there before the attack is being revealed.
    • Suddenly, if you hold a lot of territories, you'll probably want multiple GvG teams.
    • Your A-team will still be key on offense, and of course strategically be used on defense, but it won't be enough to conquer and hold vast amounts of land. Still, A-teams will continue to have fights every day.
    • Far more people will now be taking part in regular GvGs, and the total number of actual GvG fights happening will increase. Since the A-team can't seemingly be everywhere at once any more (at least not on defense), suddenly, attacking with B, C or even D teams can make sense, and the other guild will want to put B, C and D teams on defense, too.
    • If you are a small guild with few territories, not much changes for you. 1 good GvG team is still enough to hold on to your stuff.
  • JonahVeil wrote:

    KingMoJo wrote:

    JonahVeil wrote:

    I mean I respect what Derrick and his guys did, but, I have a full time job. I still played a lot after missing the first 2 weeks. And CV is highly contested. They formed a giant alliance, used a safety blanket, and sat in CV.

    They noticed their comp was shit without a glaive, after losing to Fus repeatedly, powergrinded whated and got him on a glaive, then started winning.

    A large part of this game is economy, zerging to hold down stuff, etc.

    But, I think even they can agree, specializations matter too much, and take too long to grind. I'm also sure they would prefer better fights, outspeccing everyone they fight. (Other than Nilfs team and a couple others)
    Tea Party (Fallenstarz and Talagul team) free farmed cv for first two weeks of the game, evaniskus team 2 weeks after that. We fame farmed the hard way, with bigger groups most of the time.We beat Fus team without glaive 3 times before they beat us.

    Whated can't even wear t8 glaive dude.

    We are on similar item power with most of the teams we have been fighting, as you can look up yourself in vids etc.
    Once Fus's team adjusted you guys did not beat them until switching to glaive.
    No need to defend yourself, looks bad tbh.

    And no offense to Nilfgaard, but their "A" team, is complete and utter dogshit. So ya, maybe their fame is equivalent, but those guys are playing like husks lately.
    Niilfgard A team is stronger than yours, and it has nothing to do with specializations or gear.
    You can't explain chess moves to Pokémon GO players
  • Don't see a issue with system people bitching because money guild can defend all there Terri with one team a team who's core has played together since beta 1 who play together everyday have boss communication and know game dynamics inside and out I don't see the issue I don't believe there should be a lock out anyway if I get into a fight in the pub tonight then goto another pub and shit kicks off can't be like sorry mate had a fight earlier can't participate in this one.




    Removing lock all together makes more sense to me allows teams that currently do well against teams like derrick and mojos to fight them more and get gud fam