Daggers

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    • shadows edge:

      throws (skillshot, harpoon range, bit faster travel speed) a dagger, on impact (friendly or enemy) you get teleported behind the target, rooting it for X seconds. (if enemy) or just get teleported without rooting (on friendly)
      So seems light we might get a root. Still no info on important stuff like energy cost, cooldown, root length, dagger's travel speed, animation times, damage on impact, dagger travel distance, but it can be a very good ability in theory.

      If travel speed and travel distance will be good enough it may be a very good ganking tool for all daggers, if we'll be able to root a horse from afar.
      If energy cost, travel speed and cooldown will be good, it will help to catch warbow users, will help against windwall, will help against wall of flames. Will still be useful to escape some AoEs, will be useful to escape if root is long enough. But I'd say that in order for this to work, it should have tiny manacost, amazing travel speed and 10s cooldown. It hinders mobility if picked over dash, so it has to be very good at what it does.

      I like the direction this is going, paired with 75/25 buff, but won't keep my hopes to high looking at infiltration.
    • Oki, time to necro my thread now.
      After some playtime after new patch on live I can say that Shadow Edge is much worse than I thought it would be. Actual ganking with it is worse than expected.
      First of all, if you manage to hit it long distance - the root last about the same like your travel time. So there is no root.
      Energycost reduction is so tiny it's not noticable at all, it still consumes way too much energy.
      I found myself dying in situations I'd never die in with dash. Both escaping ganks and 1v1 1vx fights. And I can assure you it's the same in mass PvP as I managed to get a taste of it in the arena during the test.

      So it's an absolutely unrewarding skillshit that does nothing when hit, takes all your mobility away, is worse than dash in every regard and requires a t6 dagger + 70 dagger mastery to use.

      I tried to used it with skinner cap so I an place a bear trap under the mount and dismount people this way without using my wanderlust to chase people better. Turns out it works only for t4 horses and not even that often. I thought it'd be possible to get atleast one sunder armor off while the enemy is rooted, then beartrap him, then got two more SA+ST so he'll be dismounted, but there is not enough time. Probably because of assassin jacket nerf. But it only has a chance to work with ambush as with any other armor you'll be seen even further away, but even with ambush if you use it at the edge of nametag vision, you'll come out of ambush early enough so your target will see it and mount up, after that - not enough time to dismount.

      If you're getting chased - you can't use it to escape, as hooking to some mob will give you mob aggro, plus it needs an actual mob to hook to, it doesn't work through obstacles so unlike dash, that you can use every 10 seconds, this thing not only has a bigger cooldown, but is so situational that even if you want to go to some mob - you'll need the mob itself positioned well enough and in clear view (not behind any obstacle).

      For group ganking - once again there is not enough time from SE alone. Besides, it's possible to dismount up to t5 armored with daggers aswell, so if you're grouped with someone, it changes nothing.

      The only good thing with it is group ganking with claws. This way it actually works, but out of group motivating pain + poison potions with dash will still work better.

      1v1 it doesn't interrupt casting, it doesn't let you kite anyone, consumes too much mana, doesn't allow you do dodge AoEs, won't help you against windwall/wall of flames, etc.

      So in the end it's a bad dash that looks cool. On t6 daggers and up. That's it.

      Slit thoat damage proportions change is nice enough to be considered a really nice buff, it saved me when I needed my damage NOW, not as a dot.

      Still had no time to get my hands on 1h dagger with hunter jacket buff, but I know for sure that it'd still be destroyed by any reflect, cc or kiting, but maybe it can be used as a frontline fighter/glass cannon for big spike DPS on some target, tho looking at the SE energy consumption reduction, I don't think 1h's energy consumption will go down that much, especially with assassin spirit getting no buff to it's energy efficiency.
    • Dethcord schrieb:

      Oki, time to necro my thread now.
      After some playtime after new patch on live I can say that Shadow Edge is much worse than I thought it would be. Actual ganking with it is worse than expected.
      First of all, if you manage to hit it long distance - the root last about the same like your travel time. So there is no root.
      Energycost reduction is so tiny it's not noticable at all, it still consumes way too much energy.
      I found myself dying in situations I'd never die in with dash. Both escaping ganks and 1v1 1vx fights. And I can assure you it's the same in mass PvP as I managed to get a taste of it in the arena during the test.

      So it's an absolutely unrewarding skillshit that does nothing when hit, takes all your mobility away, is worse than dash in every regard and requires a t6 dagger + 70 dagger mastery to use.

      I tried to used it with skinner cap so I an place a bear trap under the mount and dismount people this way without using my wanderlust to chase people better. Turns out it works only for t4 horses and not even that often. I thought it'd be possible to get atleast one sunder armor off while the enemy is rooted, then beartrap him, then got two more SA+ST so he'll be dismounted, but there is not enough time. Probably because of assassin jacket nerf. But it only has a chance to work with ambush as with any other armor you'll be seen even further away, but even with ambush if you use it at the edge of nametag vision, you'll come out of ambush early enough so your target will see it and mount up, after that - not enough time to dismount.

      If you're getting chased - you can't use it to escape, as hooking to some mob will give you mob aggro, plus it needs an actual mob to hook to, it doesn't work through obstacles so unlike dash, that you can use every 10 seconds, this thing not only has a bigger cooldown, but is so situational that even if you want to go to some mob - you'll need the mob itself positioned well enough and in clear view (not behind any obstacle).

      For group ganking - once again there is not enough time from SE alone. Besides, it's possible to dismount up to t5 armored with daggers aswell, so if you're grouped with someone, it changes nothing.

      The only good thing with it is group ganking with claws. This way it actually works, but out of group motivating pain + poison potions with dash will still work better.

      1v1 it doesn't interrupt casting, it doesn't let you kite anyone, consumes too much mana, doesn't allow you do dodge AoEs, won't help you against windwall/wall of flames, etc.

      So in the end it's a bad dash that looks cool. On t6 daggers and up. That's it.

      Slit thoat damage proportions change is nice enough to be considered a really nice buff, it saved me when I needed my damage NOW, not as a dot.

      Still had no time to get my hands on 1h dagger with hunter jacket buff, but I know for sure that it'd still be destroyed by any reflect, cc or kiting, but maybe it can be used as a frontline fighter/glass cannon for big spike DPS on some target, tho looking at the SE energy consumption reduction, I don't think 1h's energy consumption will go down that much, especially with assassin spirit getting no buff to it's energy efficiency.


      Basically everything went exactly as expected (poorly) and dagger's (with dual daggers sort of being the exception) still suck. I still won't touch Black Hands because the purge addition on the E does not make up for the Q's being terrible, nor the E lacking any mobility.

      Dieser Beitrag wurde bereits 1 mal editiert, zuletzt von Meanie ()

    • Norgannon schrieb:

      Meanie schrieb:

      What's there to roll your eyes at? You can go entire fights without touching your W and easily run out of energy with any dagger.
      Stop using poison potions and start using energy potions. (In the next major update they will be more useful) I hope I have helped you.
      Energy Potions are one of those weird items that feel like if a spec is actually working right, they're not needed. Hell, no meta spec outside healers (occasionally) run Energy Potions because they work just fine for winning without them. Most specs get to use potions that play up their strengths while Daggers best hope is to cover their glaring weaknesses. Problem is, after covering their biggest weakness, there's not enough strengths to begin with to make them worthwhile.

      I seriously doubt any GvGers or HGers will be interested in running dagger users w/energy potions in their flex spots.

      Dieser Beitrag wurde bereits 3 mal editiert, zuletzt von RockLobster ()

    • Nobody should be forced to use energy potions, not even healers. Especially when; like you pointed out, that most meta builds don't require them. They should only be for someone trying to do something like "quick casting giant nuke followed by more spells" type bursting which isn't really a thing here anyway. Why should a dagger user be stuck with energy pots when everyone else gets to lob around poison, sticky or use healing/resistance pots on themselves? Hell, we reduce our resistance using a skill for little to no payoff.
    • Hello.

      I'm new player and I've always enjoyed playing like a Rogue/Assassin on MMOs, but in Albion, i think is different.
      Daggers are so much useless? I'm afraid to choose and in the future regret.

      (Taking advantage, could you recommend options that I could use as weapons in case the Dagger is not recommended?)

      Thank you very much! And sorry for my english. hehe
    • Phoison schrieb:

      Hello.

      I'm new player and I've always enjoyed playing like a Rogue/Assassin on MMOs, but in Albion, i think is different.
      Daggers are so much useless? I'm afraid to choose and in the future regret.

      (Taking advantage, could you recommend options that I could use as weapons in case the Dagger is not recommended?)

      Thank you very much! And sorry for my english. hehe
      Daggers aren't "useless" - that's a little harsh. Here's where they currently stand

      *They're considered non-viable in large scale PvP. They need some love here, no doubt.
      *Black Hands is holding onto a thread of viability in Competitive PvP (no other dagger else even comes close). That said, it's extremely rare and almost always played by a decision maker or shot caller who can sorta build a team around themselves. They need some love here too.
      *Small Scale PvP/Ganking, things aren't too bad. Dagger Pair is quirky but decent, Claws and Bloodletter are awesome.My ganking build is actually Claws or Bloodletter, depending on our comp. Claws if we need Control, Bloodletter if we need damage or a finisher.
      *Solo Play is where Daggers shine. Bloodletter is arguably the best solo weapon in the game, as it combines great burst damage with the best mobility in the game when paired with Mistcaller.... but any Dagger is pretty mobile with the right skills.

      The more I level Daggers, the more I see some hope as I only feel Daggers can go up in strength. Joseph tried to make them decent, failed. I think in Kay, they'll take another shot at it.

      Dieser Beitrag wurde bereits 5 mal editiert, zuletzt von RockLobster ()

    • I am a big fan of pair dagger. It's just a not fun that is like one of the worst weapon of the game. If you want to dagger you should just go spear... Dagger could be a way to change the way ZvZ is fight. Set up flanking grp that can assassinate ppl. But for that, it should be at least viable in 5v5.