Scammed by Thod of the guild Besafe!

  • Sempermalum wrote:

    ... and are just a cancer on the community but their 100 dollars is worth as much as yours.

    Yes.. but this leads to that more people quit after they got scammed. It will be a bad deal for Albion in the long run. One scammer pay 100 dollar and scam 10 people and 3 of them quits.

    Im 100% against scamming or misuse of game mechanism witch this case in my opinion because we do not have a alternative for 3:rd party crafting. If the devs seems this as a part of the game then they can get on start working on a fix for this so we can ask a crafter to craft without giving materials first.

    As a compair, I lost my newbie mount thanks to me died and resurrected instead of wait 20 seconds, that is a lessen and life. But scamming, no thank.
  • Sephora wrote:

    Sempermalum wrote:

    ... and are just a cancer on the community but their 100 dollars is worth as much as yours.
    Yes.. but this leads to that more people quit after they got scammed. It will be a bad deal for Albion in the long run. One scammer pay 100 dollar and scam 10 people and 3 of them quits.

    Im 100% against scamming or misuse of game mechanism witch this case in my opinion because we do not have a alternative for 3:rd party crafting. If the devs seems this as a part of the game then they can get on start working on a fix for this so we can ask a crafter to craft without giving materials first.

    As a compair, I lost my newbie mount thanks to me died and resurrected instead of wait 20 seconds, that is a lessen and life. But scamming, no thank.
    Exactly this. Die in a redzone, you had it coming, click die, you had it coming. As a guy that mostly fame farms in expeds I barely leveld up crafting,. Met enough people that were happy to craft high quality stuff if I supplied the mats and so on. That's how it's supposed to work right? Having traders, fighters, gatherers etc. But it is as Sephora states no mechanic ingame where individual trading/crafting is 100% safe. I'll be fair, I have done several trades where there were no issues. Even trading a t5 scrap + the 5.3 mats and I got it back in full faith, in exchange for a bunch of silver to the crafter. Hes happy, im happy. Seeing as there is no actual way to not put faith in people when you do an individual craft, there either needs to be a system to keep this in check or this should be dealt with appropriately. Why would you bother being a nice person if there are too many people on this global server to remember, and if there are no repercussions from the mod team, why bother?
  • Sempermalum wrote:

    Did you even read the article?

    The ‘I was playing a thief’ argument
    The defence argued that one of the points of the game of RuneScape is to take virtual items from other players. The court noted that this was true but the way that the property was taken was outside the ‘context’ of the game.



    The way this stuff was stolen was clearly inside the context of the game, hence the I was playing a thief argument holds up, and they would throw this case out as nonsense. Kid got scammed, it sucks, scammers are the worst type of gamers, and are just a cancer on the community but their 100 dollars is worth as much as yours.
    Again, in this case it was "Fraud" and not theft. Fraud is actually a different legal matter than theft.

    And nothing in this game noted that Scamming was okay and wouldn't be punished. They didn't write on their Homepage: Go out and scam people out of their money! Have a guild battle scheduled? SWAT the enemy team! Have fun! Everything goes.

    Except a mouse afk macro. You will get lifetime ban for that.
  • Dariac wrote:

    Sephora wrote:

    Sempermalum wrote:

    ... and are just a cancer on the community but their 100 dollars is worth as much as yours.
    Yes.. but this leads to that more people quit after they got scammed. It will be a bad deal for Albion in the long run. One scammer pay 100 dollar and scam 10 people and 3 of them quits.
    Im 100% against scamming or misuse of game mechanism witch this case in my opinion because we do not have a alternative for 3:rd party crafting. If the devs seems this as a part of the game then they can get on start working on a fix for this so we can ask a crafter to craft without giving materials first.

    As a compair, I lost my newbie mount thanks to me died and resurrected instead of wait 20 seconds, that is a lessen and life. But scamming, no thank.
    Exactly this. Die in a redzone, you had it coming, click die, you had it coming. As a guy that mostly fame farms in expeds I barely leveld up crafting,. Met enough people that were happy to craft high quality stuff if I supplied the mats and so on. That's how it's supposed to work right? Having traders, fighters, gatherers etc. But it is as Sephora states no mechanic ingame where individual trading/crafting is 100% safe. I'll be fair, I have done several trades where there were no issues. Even trading a t5 scrap + the 5.3 mats and I got it back in full faith, in exchange for a bunch of silver to the crafter. Hes happy, im happy. Seeing as there is no actual way to not put faith in people when you do an individual craft, there either needs to be a system to keep this in check or this should be dealt with appropriately. Why would you bother being a nice person if there are too many people on this global server to remember, and if there are no repercussions from the mod team, why bother?
    There is a mechanic for 100% safe crafting trading it is called the auction house. But if you are giving people money for a promise then you better make sure that they are trustworthy rather than just handing over money.
  • Samantha
    Hi there,

    Thank you for reaching out to us.

    As this is a sandbox style game, players are permitted to scam other players as long as they are not exploiting game mechanics in order to do so. Going forward, I would recommend using only a trusted friend and/or guild member to assist with crafting.

    Should you have any additional questions, please let us know.

    Cordially,

    Samantha | Customer Care Agent | support@albiononline.com

    Albion Online - Craft. Trade. Conquer.




    There's your answer folks...........
  • Dariac wrote:

    I can from now on start scamming people the same way I got scammed without having to worry something will be done against me, since nothing happened to the person who scammed me in the first place. How on earth would that make any sense? You will basically just be destroying the game's community IMO if that is the case.
    Is a community built on reputation and trust really worse off than a group of strangers holding threats of reports against each other to accomplish what they want?

    I guess that's up to you, but the answer is fairly clear to me.

    Razgrizfox wrote:

    "Is this scam allowed in the game?". If it is then there is no safe way to trade items to get something crafted by a stranger without getting scammed.
    The first solution would not be to trade with a stranger. Instead, maybe look for someone in your guild or alliance. If not, find a crafter who has already built a good reputation and is known to be trustworthy. If you're unable to find someone like that, have the crafter give you something of equal value in return as insurance. Even if they refuse to craft you the item for you, you will still not lose anything in that case. Or as someone suggested, you could have them trade materials for an already crafted item.
  • It's as easy as this: Nobody can steal you something, which doesn't belong to you in the first place. The owner of this intellectual property you are talking about, is SBI. The same for WoW characters, items, etc. You are not allowed to sell them for real life money on ebay, even if it is a common thing. But AT THAT POINT you are doing something illegal, selling intellectual property of a third party.

    What I find more interesting though, is the reaction of a lot of your comments: We were scammed and it is ok? So we will do the same!!! That means for me, that you just didn't do it because you thought you were not allowed, but actually you are not one bit better than Thod. Morally you are equal. Who knows, maybe he does it because he also got recently scammed.

    After all, in a Sandbox, you should be able to be scammed as it is a "simulated" real life community in a fantasy setting. In real life you also can be scammed, even if it is illegal, but who is the ruler of the real world? Who do you call when someone scammed you? (No, not the Ghostbusters ;))

    Is there a Police in Albion? Maybe there is, maybe you want to create one. It is up to you (in the boundaries of game mechanics). The DevTeam is responsible to play police only when there is bug abuse, cheating, and anything which is against the Usage conditions and rules which you are ok with.
  • Typhoon wrote:

    It's as easy as this: Nobody can steal you something, which doesn't belong to you in the first place. The owner of this intellectual property you are talking about, is SBI. The same for WoW characters, items, etc. You are not allowed to sell them for real life money on ebay, even if it is a common thing. But AT THAT POINT you are doing something illegal, selling intellectual property of a third party.

    What I find more interesting though, is the reaction of a lot of your comments: We were scammed and it is ok? So we will do the same!!! That means for me, that you just didn't do it because you thought you were not allowed, but actually you are not one bit better than Thod. Morally you are equal. Who knows, maybe he does it because he also got recently scammed.

    After all, in a Sandbox, you should be able to be scammed as it is a "simulated" real life community in a fantasy setting. In real life you also can be scammed, even if it is illegal, but who is the ruler of the real world? Who do you call when someone scammed you? (No, not the Ghostbusters ;))

    Is there a Police in Albion? Maybe there is, maybe you want to create one. It is up to you (in the boundaries of game mechanics). The DevTeam is responsible to play police only when there is bug abuse, cheating, and anything which is against the Usage conditions and rules which you are ok with.
    Yes, bumps on this. Greatly spoken.
    Support - Holy magic.

  • Typhoon wrote:

    It's as easy as this: Nobody can steal you something, which doesn't belong to you in the first place. The owner of this intellectual property you are talking about, is SBI. The same for WoW characters, items, etc. You are not allowed to sell them for real life money on ebay, even if it is a common thing. But AT THAT POINT you are doing something illegal, selling intellectual property of a third party.

    What I find more interesting though, is the reaction of a lot of your comments: We were scammed and it is ok? So we will do the same!!! That means for me, that you just didn't do it because you thought you were not allowed, but actually you are not one bit better than Thod. Morally you are equal. Who knows, maybe he does it because he also got recently scammed.

    After all, in a Sandbox, you should be able to be scammed as it is a "simulated" real life community in a fantasy setting. In real life you also can be scammed, even if it is illegal, but who is the ruler of the real world? Who do you call when someone scammed you? (No, not the Ghostbusters ;))

    Is there a Police in Albion? Maybe there is, maybe you want to create one. It is up to you (in the boundaries of game mechanics). The DevTeam is responsible to play police only when there is bug abuse, cheating, and anything which is against the Usage conditions and rules which you are ok with.
    I disagree with your point about a simulated community where you can be scammed, only because in a fantasy community you'd in all likelihood be killed if you scammed someone with good equipment. You cant do that here, there is no recompense. Thod could hypothetically scam new players forever without every having anything happen to him. I also expect if any harassment occurred to Thod the dev team would have grounds to ban the harasser.

    The reason people are saying they'll resort to scamming to is because there is no way to enforce laws against it, you cant go to somebodies island and stop them from thieving things as far as I know. It entirely up to victims knowing about the problem. In real society laws and enforcement exist to disencourage this sort of behaviour, in Albion there can be no enforcement beyond people saying "Dont trust Thod!"
  • Elsa wrote:

    Dariac wrote:

    I can from now on start scamming people the same way I got scammed without having to worry something will be done against me, since nothing happened to the person who scammed me in the first place. How on earth would that make any sense? You will basically just be destroying the game's community IMO if that is the case.
    Is a community built on reputation and trust really worse off than a group of strangers holding threats of reports against each other to accomplish what they want?
    I guess that's up to you, but the answer is fairly clear to me.

    Razgrizfox wrote:

    "Is this scam allowed in the game?". If it is then there is no safe way to trade items to get something crafted by a stranger without getting scammed.
    The first solution would not be to trade with a stranger. Instead, maybe look for someone in your guild or alliance. If not, find a crafter who has already built a good reputation and is known to be trustworthy. If you're unable to find someone like that, have the crafter give you something of equal value in return as insurance. Even if they refuse to craft you the item for you, you will still not lose anything in that case. Or as someone suggested, you could have them trade materials for an already crafted item.
    Thx Elsa.
    I'm well aware of who to trust and who not to trust thanks to playing eve online for many many years (not been scammed yet in AO "touch wood"). But what you haven't quoted in my comment is things that in-game mechanics can do to help this not happening easily.
  • Dumbledoge wrote:

    Moggmun wrote:

    In real society laws and enforcement exist to disencourage this sort of behaviour, in Albion there can be no enforcement beyond people saying "Dont trust Thod!"
    Shouldn't this be enough for social players to acknowledge? Like bad reputation in this kinda game, like dayum....is anyone willing to work with you with such a reputation. I hella wouldnt.
    Plenty of people wont care. This stuff happened in vanilla WoW and it didn't stop until people received consequences from blizz. In an ideal world it would be enough, but there are plenty of assholes on the internet.
  • Moggmun wrote:

    Dumbledoge wrote:

    Moggmun wrote:

    In real society laws and enforcement exist to disencourage this sort of behaviour, in Albion there can be no enforcement beyond people saying "Dont trust Thod!"
    Shouldn't this be enough for social players to acknowledge? Like bad reputation in this kinda game, like dayum....is anyone willing to work with you with such a reputation. I hella wouldnt.
    Plenty of people wont care. This stuff happened in vanilla WoW and it didn't stop until people received consequences from blizz. In an ideal world it would be enough, but there are plenty of assholes on the internet.
    Thats the bit that needs changed a war mechanic or something so you can attack them in green(and they can attack you also) . There needs to be a mechanic for the player to deal with scams. Not for the devs to stop the scams
  • Typhoon wrote:

    It's as easy as this: Nobody can steal you something, which doesn't belong to you in the first place. The owner of this intellectual property you are talking about, is SBI. The same for WoW characters, items, etc. You are not allowed to sell them for real life money on ebay, even if it is a common thing. But AT THAT POINT you are doing something illegal, selling intellectual property of a third party.

    What I find more interesting though, is the reaction of a lot of your comments: We were scammed and it is ok? So we will do the same!!! That means for me, that you just didn't do it because you thought you were not allowed, but actually you are not one bit better than Thod. Morally you are equal. Who knows, maybe he does it because he also got recently scammed.

    After all, in a Sandbox, you should be able to be scammed as it is a "simulated" real life community in a fantasy setting. In real life you also can be scammed, even if it is illegal, but who is the ruler of the real world? Who do you call when someone scammed you? (No, not the Ghostbusters ;))

    Is there a Police in Albion? Maybe there is, maybe you want to create one. It is up to you (in the boundaries of game mechanics). The DevTeam is responsible to play police only when there is bug abuse, cheating, and anything which is against the Usage conditions and rules which you are ok with.
    Not theft it's fraud. Thats a different law... stop talking about theft.

    German law does not see virtuall goods the same as "real" goods. So you can not steal virtual goods. But they are still defined as an asset. So scamming someone out of it would be illegal.
  • seveneddy wrote:

    Typhoon wrote:

    It's as easy as this: Nobody can steal you something, which doesn't belong to you in the first place. The owner of this intellectual property you are talking about, is SBI. The same for WoW characters, items, etc. You are not allowed to sell them for real life money on ebay, even if it is a common thing. But AT THAT POINT you are doing something illegal, selling intellectual property of a third party.

    What I find more interesting though, is the reaction of a lot of your comments: We were scammed and it is ok? So we will do the same!!! That means for me, that you just didn't do it because you thought you were not allowed, but actually you are not one bit better than Thod. Morally you are equal. Who knows, maybe he does it because he also got recently scammed.

    After all, in a Sandbox, you should be able to be scammed as it is a "simulated" real life community in a fantasy setting. In real life you also can be scammed, even if it is illegal, but who is the ruler of the real world? Who do you call when someone scammed you? (No, not the Ghostbusters ;))

    Is there a Police in Albion? Maybe there is, maybe you want to create one. It is up to you (in the boundaries of game mechanics). The DevTeam is responsible to play police only when there is bug abuse, cheating, and anything which is against the Usage conditions and rules which you are ok with.
    Not theft it's fraud. Thats a different law... stop talking about theft.
    German law does not see virtuall goods the same as "real" goods. So you can not steal virtual goods. But they are still defined as an asset. So scamming someone out of it would be illegal.

    German law? What does that have to do with the game? It would be US law that applies, you know the server is there. That is at least to my knowledge as a it forensic.
  • Mugyou wrote:

    Rhaegor wrote:

    Only an idiot would trade materials to someone outside of their guild or alliance for crafting.
    And solo players are supposed to do what exactly? Your ignorance is showing.
    As a solo player, you still have the possibility to either craft it on your own island or in the city.
    Welcome to a big boy MMO, i am sorry this game does not have rules to protect the naive from people with bad intentions.

    You should not get attached to your items in this game, unless you want to get stuck in blue/yellow zones.