Reputation lock for dreaded should be red zone or higher

  • I'm sure there are other ways to make having a negative reputation bad. Instead of locking out PvP. Once the game is out for a decent amount of time PvP in red zones will be non-existent. (Which is probably what they want)

    postlarval is being very childish. It's actually kind of aggravating.
    Suggestion...

    Skitted wrote:


    if you are blue you should see red zergs (circle)

    If you are red you should see blue zergs

    Two different colors maybe fading red to blue depending on their percentage :)

    Doesn't solve the problem of major reputation loss though
    It's an interesting concept but then flagged people would be at a greater disadvantage. Solo/small groups at least if they run into large flagged zergs.
  • Mugyou wrote:




    postlarval is being very childish. It's actually kind of aggravating.
    Oh please. The only childish people around here are you constant whiners who want to wear big boy pants but are too afraid to do it in black zones so you want to KoS in red zones with reduced consequence. GTFO

    There are plenty of players in black zones who can handle themselves and are not part of a zerg. I'm sure they would just tell you to learn how to play the game.
  • postlarval wrote:

    Mugyou wrote:

    postlarval is being very childish. It's actually kind of aggravating.
    Oh please. The only childish people around here are you constant whiners who want to wear big boy pants but are too afraid to do it in black zones so you want to KoS in red zones with reduced consequence. GTFO
    There are plenty of players in black zones who can handle themselves and are not part of a zerg. I'm sure they would just tell you to learn how to play the game.

    Really? Can you take a territory by yourself? Can you gank a player by yourself? Yes there are players managing in blackzone, but they have to avoid all pvp. Black zone pvp comes mostly in huge zergs.

    The reputation system is clearly unfair and unbalanced.
  • Korn wrote:

    I think a key point from my response above seems to get lost in the discussion.
    • If you want unrestricted PvP with no penalties or limits, go to the black zones
    • If we soften up the PvP rules in the red zones, they will turn into de facto black zones. We have verified this over countless tests
    It is not possible to have a PvP system that allows gankers to kill victims without limit while at the same time preventing zergs from forming who counter those gankers and while at the same time preventing these zones from turning into wastelands as normal players won't go there any more, making these zones unattractive for the gankers as well. This is a hard fact - if you disagree, please name an example game from the past 10 years where this has ever worked.
    It has never worked because the devs are not creative enough, most of the time they dont even listen to players. Its extremely rare to see devs like you guys who actively participate in conversations with the players.

    Here is a system that will stop zergs and allow small scale pvp.

    Put a counter on every player. That counter will store the amount of attackers.
    Example, Player A gets attacked by Player B. Player A counter increases by 1. Placer C also attacks player A, now player A counter increases.to 2. Every time Player A counter increases(it only increases when a new player attacks him) Player A gets an increased buff. Lets say player A counter is 1, thenno Buff is gained. When the player A counter reaches 2, he gets a buff, like increased defense and increased attack. If player A counter increases to 3(3.players attacking player A) player A buffs increase even more, allowing player A to get strong enough to be able to beat the 3 attackers or, atleast to be able.to easily.escape the attackers.

    The system I mentioned above have a flaw, and that is that a friend could attack player A so that player A gets the bonuses and gain an advantage in battle. To prevent this, atackers(even if they are blues attacking a red) become flagged red. Those who flag red wont be able to flag blue for a very long time(hours). So basically, if a player is the first one to attack, he gets flagged red. If a player doesnt want to flag red, he must wait until he has atleast one attacker counter.
    To make small scale atractive, the buffs start acumulating after player.counter reaches 3(gain the first buff when 3 playersnare attacking)

    The system above, in combination With a softer reputation system would work very well.

    This is just one way of punishing zergs without punishing small scale pvp. There may be other ways, ofcourse there will always be flaws to every system, but its better than simply limiting the amount of pvp a player can do.

    Your reputation sistem is still a good system, but again its too punishing. Whats the flaw of your system? High positive reputation. The reputation lost for virtous and up is way too much, what this causes is that players will only be able to.engage in small scale pvp for a very limited time per week.

    Limiting the time a player can pvp is good to prevent players from making redzones just like blackzones, but you guys are limiting it way too much. Again, you are not able to see the results because there arent many players with high reputation, but in the future most players will reach atleast virtuous reputation. When that happends, redzone pvp will be very scarce.

    What you must understand is that players want a system where they can pvp in small scale, a system that punishes zergs heavily but doesnt punishes small scale pkers. I mentioned an example of how to do this above, such example is posible to make(I am studying programmign so I know its posible)

    There are ways, again all systems will have flaws. But you must find one that doesnt require the player to farm for days just to have 20 minutes of pvp before having to farm for days once again.

    The post was edited 1 time, last by Holoin ().

  • Holoin wrote:

    ...
    Limiting the time a player can pvp is.good, to prevent players from making redzones just like blackzones, but you guys are limiting it way too much. Again, you are not able to see the results because there arebt many players with high reputation, but innthe future most players will reach atleast virtuous reputation. When that happends, redzone pvp will be ver scarce.

    ...
    imho, having scarce Pvp in red zones is exactly where the game needs to be..

    it needs to be scarce so that non-pvper do risk the red zones to gather, and zerglings that do not use moderation in their targe choics need to be banished in black zones.

    I believe the only issue right now could easily be fixed but giving more rep to all players joining the game, and preventing rep regereration while a toon is not logged. ...
  • Another less intrussive way of solving some of the problems is by increasing reputation gains, or giving players a nice reputation amount for killing other players with negative reputation, even if they kill a blue flagged player with negative reputation. Players with negative reputation can still obtain the bonus reputation gain by killing other players with negative reputations.

    Another way of solving the problems is by adding a new area, a small island where criminals can go, and area that has content specificaly for criminals, like specific dungeons that require negative rep to enter, or dark expeditions that allow criminals to redeem themself by doing these type of expeditions only accecible with negative rep etc..this way criminals wont have to farm reputation in a boring way.

    Again, even more ideas to solve some of your problems, lets hope you guys stop saying there is no other way than what you have now.
  • grisix wrote:

    Holoin wrote:

    ...
    Limiting the time a player can pvp is.good, to prevent players from making redzones just like blackzones, but you guys are limiting it way too much. Again, you are not able to see the results because there arebt many players with high reputation, but innthe future most players will reach atleast virtuous reputation. When that happends, redzone pvp will be ver scarce.

    ...
    imho, having scarce Pvp in red zones is exactly where the game needs to be..
    it needs to be scarce so that non-pvper do risk the red zones to gather, and zerglings that do not use moderation in their targe choics need to be banished in black zones.

    I believe the only issue right now could easily be fixed but giving more rep to all players joining the game, and preventing rep regereration while a toon is not logged. ...
    Lol no, the idea of what players want for redzone is a place where they can do small.scale pvp without the fear of running into zergs.

    When redzone pvp starts to get scarce, the game will lose a lot of players because this is a pvp game. Pvp games where pvp is limited is very bad in the long term, it has happened before, games always fail when pvp starts to het limited.

    What you sugested is the oposite of what needs to happen. The biggest problem of the system is high reputation, giving starting players more reputation will be even worse for the game, again, check other games that have tried to limit pvp, they all fail in the long run. Actually, the reputation system would be good if you would lost 250 per kill no matter how high their reputation is. The buggest flaw of the system is how much reputation is lost by virtous and higer ranks.
  • grisix wrote:

    Holoin wrote:

    ...
    Limiting the time a player can pvp is.good, to prevent players from making redzones just like blackzones, but you guys are limiting it way too much. Again, you are not able to see the results because there arebt many players with high reputation, but innthe future most players will reach atleast virtuous reputation. When that happends, redzone pvp will be ver scarce.

    ...
    imho, having scarce Pvp in red zones is exactly where the game needs to be..
    it needs to be scarce so that non-pvper do risk the red zones to gather, and zerglings that do not use moderation in their targe choics need to be banished in black zones.

    I believe the only issue right now could easily be fixed but giving more rep to all players joining the game, and preventing rep regereration while a toon is not logged. ...
    Then play in yellow zones, which are safe. Not red zones, which are full loot pvp zones.
    [img]http://i.imgur.com/3DyVAgJ.png[/img]
  • Holoin wrote:

    grisix wrote:

    Holoin wrote:

    ...
    Limiting the time a player can pvp is.good, to prevent players from making redzones just like blackzones, but you guys are limiting it way too much. Again, you are not able to see the results because there arebt many players with high reputation, but innthe future most players will reach atleast virtuous reputation. When that happends, redzone pvp will be ver scarce.

    ...
    imho, having scarce Pvp in red zones is exactly where the game needs to be..it needs to be scarce so that non-pvper do risk the red zones to gather, and zerglings that do not use moderation in their targe choics need to be banished in black zones.

    I believe the only issue right now could easily be fixed but giving more rep to all players joining the game, and preventing rep regereration while a toon is not logged. ...
    Lol no, the idea of what players want for redzone is a place where they can do small.scale pvp without the fear of running into zergs.
    When redzone pvp starts to get scarce, the game will lose a lot of players because this is a pvp game. Pvp games where pvp is limited is very bad in the long term, it has happened before, games always fail when pvp starts to het limited.

    What you sugested is the oposite of what needs to happen. The biggest problem of the system is high reputation, giving starting players more reputation will be even worse for the game, again, check other games that have tried to limit pvp, they all fail in the long run. Actually, the reputation system would be good if you would lost 250 per kill no matter how high their reputation is. The buggest flaw of the system is how much reputation is lost by virtous and higer ranks.
    This is a sandbox game not a pvp game. The sandbox has both pve and pvp aspects in fact in all MMOs pve activity vastly outweighs pvp which is why pve is a huge part of the sandbox.
  • Korn wrote:

    It is not possible to have a PvP system that allows gankers to kill victims without limit while at the same time preventing zergs from forming who counter those gankers and while at the same time preventing these zones from turning into wastelands as normal players won't go there any more, making these zones unattractive for the gankers as well. This is a hard fact - if you disagree, please name an example game from the past 10 years where this has ever worked.
    We're not asking for "without limits" we're asking for the limits to be retuned. The -500 MINIMAL penalty is devastating and discourages emergent gameplay.

    OP's title has a great fix, make the -rep zone lock include redzones, BOOM. Problem solved.

    Bandits can be bandits and everyone has a good ol time


    An example game from the past 10 years where this has ever worked?

    Archeage
    Vanilla WoW/TBC (Southshore, QuelDanas)


    and that's literally it because MMOs are carebear nowadays an pvp is always instanced and 'balanced'

    Before that I guess we had Ultima and even Graal Online.


    We have a GREAT sandbox game here, let us enjoy it.

    The post was edited 2 times, last by TheCheapStuff ().

  • Mirean wrote:

    If you don't like reputation loss, go to black and PvP. Red zone is supposed to be targeted PvP, as per the Dev post. If you see someone running around with a nice glowing weapon, it may be worth the rep loss for that one kill. If you kill every carebear you see, then you eventually get punished for trying to abuse the zone.
    The punishment needs to be a bunch of +rep players coming back and pushing your shit in, NOT the game forcibly removing you from play.


    SHIT

    Make a bounty board so you can put hits out on people, or a bounty system so you are more and more valuable of a target the lower your rep is.

    I'm just astounded that the game is fairly hardcore in many ways but managed to drop the ball so hard on pvp.
  • TheCheapStuff wrote:

    Mirean wrote:

    If you don't like reputation loss, go to black and PvP. Red zone is supposed to be targeted PvP, as per the Dev post. If you see someone running around with a nice glowing weapon, it may be worth the rep loss for that one kill. If you kill every carebear you see, then you eventually get punished for trying to abuse the zone.
    The punishment needs to be a bunch of +rep players coming back and pushing your shit in, NOT the game forcibly removing you from play.

    SHIT

    Make a bounty board so you can put hits out on people, or a bounty system so you are more and more valuable of a target the lower your rep is.

    I'm just astounded that the game is fairly hardcore in many ways but managed to drop the ball so hard on pvp.
    A bounty system would work a million times better than the current. Do you know how awesome it would be to kill off the lowest rep players for cash?

    Imagine catching a player like me or veton, who every beta have had insane -reps...millions of silver, boom.
    [img]http://i.imgur.com/3DyVAgJ.png[/img]
  • Harambae wrote:

    A bounty system would work a million times better than the current. Do you know how awesome it would be to kill off the lowest rep players for cash?
    Imagine catching a player like me or veton, who every beta have had insane -reps...millions of silver, boom.
    They could even make a System Message announcing that a notorious villain has been slain. It would be amazing lol.
  • TheCheapStuff wrote:

    Harambae wrote:

    A bounty system would work a million times better than the current. Do you know how awesome it would be to kill off the lowest rep players for cash?
    Imagine catching a player like me or veton, who every beta have had insane -reps...millions of silver, boom.
    They could even make a System Message announcing that a notorious villain has been slain. It would be amazing lol.
    +1 for ideas that sound good. Even EVE which SBI sucks off and attempts to emulate uses a bounty system.
    [img]http://i.imgur.com/3DyVAgJ.png[/img]
  • 1000 yes bounty system. Hell let the bounty board tell you which zone the really bad players are in. Tweak the damage bonus for the postive rep players so the non pvpers have a chance then you have a excellent tool for emergent gameplay.

    Tldr - Bounty board funded by the silver dropped by ganked players. Gankers only get gear silver goes to bounty board.

    Do this please. I want to be a bounty hunter

    Edit - prevention of gaming the system may be hard might need to have that the bandit needs a minimum item level for the bounter hunter to claim the kill?
  • TheCheapStuff wrote:

    Mirean wrote:

    If you don't like reputation loss, go to black and PvP. Red zone is supposed to be targeted PvP, as per the Dev post. If you see someone running around with a nice glowing weapon, it may be worth the rep loss for that one kill. If you kill every carebear you see, then you eventually get punished for trying to abuse the zone.
    The punishment needs to be a bunch of +rep players coming back and pushing your shit in, NOT the game forcibly removing you from play.

    SHIT

    Make a bounty board so you can put hits out on people, or a bounty system so you are more and more valuable of a target the lower your rep is.

    I'm just astounded that the game is fairly hardcore in many ways but managed to drop the ball so hard on pvp.
    Bounty system has never worked. Name a game where the bounty system actually meant something.
  • Darlantan wrote:

    TheCheapStuff wrote:

    Mirean wrote:

    If you don't like reputation loss, go to black and PvP. Red zone is supposed to be targeted PvP, as per the Dev post. If you see someone running around with a nice glowing weapon, it may be worth the rep loss for that one kill. If you kill every carebear you see, then you eventually get punished for trying to abuse the zone.
    The punishment needs to be a bunch of +rep players coming back and pushing your shit in, NOT the game forcibly removing you from play.
    SHIT

    Make a bounty board so you can put hits out on people, or a bounty system so you are more and more valuable of a target the lower your rep is.

    I'm just astounded that the game is fairly hardcore in many ways but managed to drop the ball so hard on pvp.
    Bounty system has never worked. Name a game where the bounty system actually meant something.
    Eve online

    Edit: This is the game SBI bases a lot of their mechanics off, so if you disagree, you're simply proving us further correct. /trapped
    [img]http://i.imgur.com/3DyVAgJ.png[/img]