Expedition - roles are broken

    • Expedition - roles are broken

      It seems to me the algorithm used to create groups in expedition has a few flaws, one of which is to have multiple healers or not healers at all in a group.

      Another one being that plate wearing players are considered tanks. Since many arcane players use plate gear it leads to having no real tank when an arcane player joins a group.

      Is this being improved at all or not ?
      /Arghun [Maraudeurs]
      maraudeurs.info

    • the problem with no healer is that people start as healer to get in quick and switch to a weapon they want to level up
      and 2 healers or 2 tanks is always an option when there are not enough dps

      for the arcane there is nothing wrong bcasue a well played arcane can make a cloth mage as tanky as a hamemr in plate when the mage knows about movement and how to pull

      we just need an option to identify who registered as healer so he can be kicked when he is not healing!
      I guard my king with heart and soul!
    • Are we even sure it needs to have one healer to start a group? I was in a group today that had 3 guild members who were pretty angry that there is no healer so it was not one of them who did sign up as healer and changed weapons, I didn't either and the last guy left and was replaced with dps.
    • Neu

      I am getting pretty disappointed in this. With release 2 months away, we're finally coming back to test and decide if we're going to play after all the changes for better & worse. 2/3s of my expeditions have been flops either from errors or (much more likely) someone swapping their weapon--especially when it removes the healer. This is both a waste of time in queue and waiting out the registration penalty.

      Before someone says, "Well then you should heal." I am queuing up as tank, so I think I'm doing my part.

      Horrendous design as it stands.

      Permafrost - Guild Leader of Ganked Again
      gankedagain.com
    • Neu

      Permabad schrieb:

      I am getting pretty disappointed in this. With release 2 months away, we're finally coming back to test and decide if we're going to play after all the changes for better & worse. 2/3s of my expeditions have been flops either from errors or (much more likely) someone swapping their weapon--especially when it removes the healer. This is both a waste of time in queue and waiting out the registration penalty.

      Before someone says, "Well then you should heal." I am queuing up as tank, so I think I'm doing my part.

      Horrendous design as it stands.
      If you want to evaluate the game for release, I'd suggest checking back when Hector is out. There'll be a whole bunch of major changes in it - including the "see what role people signed up for" feature I mentioned above :)
    • Neu

      Monochrome schrieb:

      If you want to evaluate the game for release, I'd suggest checking back when Hector is out. There'll be a whole bunch of major changes in it - including the "see what role people signed up for" feature I mentioned above :)
      So... your solution to poor design is to compound it by leading us to shame each other and create a new brand of toxicity in the community? I mean, I *REALLY* want this game and your development team to succeed (and I've backed up those wishes with a monetary investment), but it's the ramifications of these types of decisions that give me pause.

      Permafrost - Guild Leader of Ganked Again
      gankedagain.com
    • Neu

      Permabad schrieb:

      So... your solution to poor design is to compound it by leading us to shame each other and create a new brand of toxicity in the community? I mean, I *REALLY* want this game and your development team to succeed (and I've backed up those wishes with a monetary investment), but it's the ramifications of these types of decisions that give me pause.
      Well, that's some very loaded language. Why not try this?

      So... your solution to player behavior in a sand box game is to create tools allowing other players to decide how they interact in the community? I mean, I *REALLY* want this game and your development team to succeed (and I've backed up those wishes with a monetary investment), but it's moving away from the rigid, authoritarian, theme-park model that give me pause.
      The first response of the developers to a player induced problem in a sandbox game should ALWAYS be to give other players the tools to deal with the problem.
    • Neu

      Taurean schrieb:

      The first response of the developers to a player induced problem in a sandbox game should ALWAYS be to give other players the tools to deal with the problem.
      Well, this is a feedback forum; I would expect all language here to be loaded as we appeal for changes. I agree with what you said: eliminate the timer and let people immediately re-queue if they get stuck with freeloaders trying to scam the system. Don't point out the scam artist if the players cannot actually do anything about said misdeeds.

      Zotar schrieb:

      There wouldn't be any toxicity if the person signed up to be healer heals people, and the tank tanks. If there's any toxicity involved, its already there, just harder to identify.
      Unfortunately, the problem does not just solve itself or these pleas for change wouldn't exist.

      Permafrost - Guild Leader of Ganked Again
      gankedagain.com
    • Neu

      Permabad schrieb:

      I am getting pretty disappointed in this. With release 2 months away, we're finally coming back to test and decide if we're going to play after all the changes for better & worse. 2/3s of my expeditions have been flops either from errors or (much more likely) someone swapping their weapon--especially when it removes the healer. This is both a waste of time in queue and waiting out the registration penalty.

      Permabad schrieb:

      So... your solution to poor design is to compound it by leading us to shame each other and create a new brand of toxicity in the community? I mean, I *REALLY* want this game and your development team to succeed (and I've backed up those wishes with a monetary investment), but it's the ramifications of these types of decisions that give me pause.

      Let me make sure I'm hearing you correctly. You're upset and unsure if you'll play the game because the expedition finder isn't working perfectly and people are finding a way to work around the system to cheat the queue?

      Did you play in any of the previous betas? When I returned after a 6-7 month break, I was absolutely astounded that people were advertising about looking for groups. I was even more amazed when I saw that the group expedition system was actually an automatic group finder. Back when I played, no one would dare even consider joining a random group, since you were sure to be brought into a hellgate or someplace then kicked from the group and ganked. To see so many people interacting and coordinating about groups is like night and day from before.

      I'm not going to pull the ole, "back in my day" schtick on you here, but I do have to say that I'm not sure you're going to find the level of hand-holding and perfection you seek in ANY game outside of World of Warcraft. Especially, not in an experiential new game design.

      If you have some ideas on how to effectively force group roles in a game with a classless skill system, I'm sure the devs would love to hear your thoughts.
      "You've got to remember that these are just simple farmers. These are people of the land. The common clay of the new West. You know... morons." - Gene Wilder, Blazing Saddles
    • Neu

      Permabad schrieb:

      Well, this is a feedback forum; I would expect all language here to be loaded as we appeal for changes. I agree with what you said: eliminate the timer and let people immediately re-queue if they get stuck with freeloaders trying to scam the system. Don't point out the scam artist if the players cannot actually do anything about said misdeeds.
      As I understand the system, you can vote to kick people and the matchmaker will refill their role.
    • Neu

      Monochrome schrieb:

      Permabad schrieb:

      Well, this is a feedback forum; I would expect all language here to be loaded as we appeal for changes. I agree with what you said: eliminate the timer and let people immediately re-queue if they get stuck with freeloaders trying to scam the system. Don't point out the scam artist if the players cannot actually do anything about said misdeeds.
      As I understand the system, you can vote to kick people and the matchmaker will refill their role.
      This is correct.