Feedback About the Crossbow: description, opinions and suggestions

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    • Feedback About the Crossbow: description, opinions and suggestions

      Hello,

      I would like to share my feedback about the crossbow in general, comparing it with other ranged weapons in terms of efficiency, also the different situations and enemies and how it cope. I have played several weapons and combination of armors since November in Albion and I reached a decent level of gear that enable me to discuss the topic.
      My favorite class so far is the crossbow, it is hard to play and it has a lot of flaws, but somehow, it's closer to my game play and style than the other weapons. I got a little pissed about it at first, but after trying harder I like it, it's fun when it works.

      1- Crossbow characteristics


      The crossbow is supposed to be a big ranged dps weapon, that's its main attributes, it doesn't have much of anything else and a poor choice of skills diversity. only one Q (channeled low damage high repetition skill), two W (bump, and trap).

      2- Spells

      Q spell
      You're forced to be immobile to use your main skill the Q. The amount of damage it does isn't so amazing for a damage dealer if you consider the time it takes to deal that amount of damage approximatively 4/4,5 sec. if you compare with other ranged weapons it actually deals less damage in the same amount of time,
      In PVE you can use it quite well most of the time, but in PVP most of the time an enemy player will run away from the range of your channeling skill in no time while you stay "rooted" to the ground. In numbers on a T4 based comparison, which remains proportional as tier goes up considering only the Q skills on a 5 seconds duration:
      - bow:299x2= 598 + 2 auto attack 53 each => 704
      - frost staff: 4x170= 680, plus it does some slow
      - crossbow: 34x16= 544 + maybe one auto attack 67 each => 611 (and you have to be immobile the all time, wich most of the time won't happen because of the crazy sound you make with this skill you tend to attract interrupters and then it has a 5 sec cooldown, wich is quite big for a Q spell, on the other hand it can slow the casting duration of a spell some times )
      - firestaff: (195x2) + 3x18 from ignite + 21 = 444 auto attacks 44 each => 532 yes firestaff does less damage than frost on Q spell, (it has the tactical aspect of the ignite if it applies...)


      W spell

      So what is the stronger skill for a ranged damage dealer on the W? well , a bump that deals little damage or a trap that deals little damage as well and slow the target(s).
      Most of the time the trap will touch one target, in pve you can slow a pack of mobs if your tank did a good job getting them closer, in pvp it's really rare to affect more than one target, and often people will just avoid the trap, to be effective you need to wait the opponent to be already in contact with you so you need to wait the melee opponents to hit you, and most of them will root you so your slow is less effective, then it's totally useless, or they can stun you and it has the same effect, so it's not really good to for a ranger to be in contact to be able to use a skill which will often not be effective. Of course you can escape it but, isn't it ironic to use an escape to get away from the effect produced by your first escape skill? a lot of work for not much effect because you're barely dealing any damage during this time.

      The bump skill, I personally didn't use much when it was the exclusive choice because of it's uselessness. in pve it's hard to use it as an interrupt because of the cast time speed, it makes it hard to negotiate the window of opportunity, you basically need to cast it before the target start to cast.... it a blind guess, in pvp it doesn't buy much time from attacking melee characters and is totally useless against another range dps, more likely you'll help an enemy to escape from you.

      On the other hand, W spells of other classes are way effective: frost staff has a frost bomb a wider AOE that slows from a distance, it doesn't do a lot of damage (more than the trap) but is way more effective in term of use. The fire staff has the ignite, an instant skill with little cd (10 sec) that deals a great instant damage plus damage every second, for a very high total. The bow has the frost shot, that slows an AOE and bump you back, more effective than the trap to keep you safe, or a speed shot to give you more mobility, in escape or chase basically you can't run away from a bow with this skill. The cursed staff has several options that are quite efficient, the beam will deal a big amount of damage in channel, a debuff to reduce resistance and make damage higher you and your team, or a root that add a curse. Those are real skills, in comparison the crossbow W is quite useless and ineffective.

      E spell


      It's been said already, the snipe shot is long, the exploding shot is hard to place, only the sweeping bolt is well balanced except maybe a long cool down (25 sec).

      Snipe shot: So to be able to use the snipe shot, you need to hope your enemy doesn't see you for a long while, the 3 sec casting time is very long, it affects only one target, and the damage it does may seem high, but it is comparable with other skills, it's lower than the E of a dual dagger or a Cursed staff, and they both deal damage all along by stacking curses or debuffs, while the crossbow is just standing and not dealing anything, unable to move for a skill that will most likely won't hit anyone and set you in a dangerous position. To make it more efficient, you need to place a trap. Effective in PVE, in PVP the trap is easily canceled by dashes, roots or other things. On 1v1 if you ever dare to try it, you'll be dead before the skill is released in most of the cases, and if it ever hits your opponent, it will deal some damage yes, but not enough to mean something. So this skill is very hard to use right in pvp, comparing to the effect it does, you need to be forgotten, not seen, and if the opponent tries to run away from your skill, he will succeed since it takes so long to cast. Also the range of the snipe shot is short: 9m, and in Albion 9m means, one step away from melee.
      Exploding shot:
      It is very hard to use this skill properly, but it can be fun, But you need to be patient. Patient first to master the skill. Patient also because it take 1 sec cast (acceptable) but also will explode after 5 seconds, yes 6 seconds is forever in a fight. It does some damage, but it's not crazy when you consider the time it takes, also the range again is short 9m. Also, if the target dies before the bomb explode, the bomb will explode but not deal any damage, and in some cases, the bomb exploded but didn't deal any damage to the living target (even players), I'm not sure if it's because i was too far from it. Again for the time it takes the AOE damage isn't crazy, it's half of a fireball in terms of damage and AOE and it takes longer to happen, The good aspect of this skill is that people usually don't realize that they have been affected by a bomb, so it's not visible like the other AOE skills that you can see on the ground.
      Sweeping bolt:
      This skill is the most balanced of the crossbow and the most effective. It does a decent instant damage on a ok range. But again it's not crazy as damage, and has a long cool down of 25sec.


      Passive spells:
      They're both useless to make it short. the range bonus is ok, but since all your skill except sweeping bolts need 9m radius, it's as if you don't have a passive spell, and also for the attack boost bonus, the crossbow will rarely or never use auto attacks because of the way the skills are built, especially the heavy crossbow with its very very slow attack rate, it makes it the less effective crossbow in auto attacks.

      3- Conclusion and suggestions:

      The crossbow loses most (or almost all) of its one on one fights with similar level of gears on (with the condition you play against someone who knows how to play, anyone can win against a newbie or someone unskilled), especially against other range damage dealers who are not even doing controls on it, just in term of burst. So, it does mean that the crossbow isn't the damage dealer it's supposed to be. it can't really control or escape, it hurts only if it's not taken care of by the enemies, and even then it doesn't hurt as much as the other range damage dealers if they're not taken care of.
      I personally think, the range overall is a first problem, all the E spells should have a longer range. the snipe shot could have a boost somehow like casting time maybe.
      the exploding shot could take less time to explode, and the explosion should affect the area even after the target who got the bomb stuck on dies, also it could make a little more damage as an AOE.
      The sweeping bolt, could have a shorter cool down duration, when you think about it, the ignite of the fire staff (on comparable level) deals more damage than the sweeping bolt, yes the sweeping bolt can affect more than one target so it could compensate the damage difference, but ignite has a 10 sec cool down, that's just an example.
      The Q spell, there should be another option for that Q, the channeling doesn't do the burst it's supposed to do on the 5 seconds it takes, and slowing casting times is a case we don't meet much unless we meet a crossbow on snipe shot maybe? how ironic.
      The W spell, is the main thing to change, I'm thinking of a glue bomb (or shoot on the feet): a skill that slow a small area like the trap, but from a distance. There could be also a crippling shot (or shoot on the hand) a skill on Q or W, that deals damage and cancel the use of skills for some time, making the target only able to use auto attacks.
      The crossbow is super dependent to be a little effective, it has a bigger handicap than it deserve. it should either gain efficiency in dealing damage to become the damage dealer it's supposed to be, or gain diversification with the skills it provides.
    • thoughts, being a new player.

      Q: slightly more damage shorter, channel time. say 12shots in 4secs your example 48-53 dmg
      W: Perhaps a "penetrating shot" with bleed or slow, moderate damage
      W: Caltrops having a bit of range,Stacking Debuff as they move through it
      E; Snipe: Longer range
      Explosive Shot: larger aoe
      Sweeping Shot, not much to add it seems to be the GO TO skill atm.
    • Solmendil schrieb:

      Hello,

      I would like to share my feedback about the crossbow in general, comparing it with other ranged weapons in terms of efficiency, also the different situations and enemies and how it cope. I have played several weapons and combination of armors since November in Albion and I reached a decent level of gear that enable me to discuss the topic.
      My favorite class so far is the crossbow, it is hard to play and it has a lot of flaws, but somehow, it's closer to my game play and style than the other weapons. I got a little pissed about it at first, but after trying harder I like it, it's fun when it works.

      2- Spells

      Q spell
      You're forced to be immobile to use your main skill the Q. The amount of damage it does isn't so amazing for a damage dealer if you consider the time it takes to deal that amount of damage approximatively 4/4,5 sec. if you compare with other ranged weapons it actually deals less damage in the same amount of time,
      In PVE you can use it quite well most of the time, but in PVP most of the time an enemy player will run away from the range of your channeling skill in no time while you stay "rooted" to the ground. In numbers on a T4 based comparison, which remains proportional as tier goes up considering only the Q skills on a 5 seconds duration:
      - bow:299x2= 598 + 2 auto attack 53 each => 704
      - frost staff: 4x170= 680, plus it does some slow
      - crossbow: 34x16= 544 + maybe one auto attack 67 each => 611 (and you have to be immobile the all time, wich most of the time won't happen because of the crazy sound you make with this skill you tend to attract interrupters and then it has a 5 sec cooldown, wich is quite big for a Q spell, on the other hand it can slow the casting duration of a spell some times )
      - firestaff: (195x2) + 3x18 from ignite + 21 = 444 auto attacks 44 each => 532 yes firestaff does less damage than frost on Q spell, (it has the tactical aspect of the ignite if it applies...)
      I am not sure how decent of a gear you have reached or what kind of PvP situations that you have been into, but after the Brutus buff to Crossbow tree, many players started to use crossbows as it is actually a pretty strong weapon. Also in GvG it became a reliable weapon as well. So let's assume that you are sincere with your feedback and not trolling, I really think that you simply aren't aware of how capable of a weapon that it became, also I think there will be some nerfs to it as it is a little too strong compared to some other weapons.

      Also when you compare skills, since you actually went and did some kind of a math here, all those Qs do have a cast time where they become immobile, spend more energy and just as avoidable as your channeling. So you are not doing the comparison right here at all. Also not every weapon is made for 1v1 fights, you should remember that too.
      [img]http://i.imgur.com/u207xaO.png[/img]
    • Thank you for the constructive replies.
      It is hard to say all about it, my thread is seriously already too long, and I don't want to kill readers with boredom, So i just gave samples of exemples to illustrate.
      What I meant to say is that, it's not a a crazy dps like people tend to think. I'm not saying it's a weak dps either, there are other reactions possible than extreme with several layers of shades.
      In GvG yes crossbow is somehow effective on .3, why? because it's not focused most of the time so it can dps quietly, and the swiping bolt can interupted from a far distance. But GvG isn't the situation you meet the most and is not for the bigger part of players, also it has a very specific game play and rules you don't meet anywhere else.. What we do most of the time is farming ressources, improving gear with PVE, or roam for fun in pvp. Crossbow is good in medium or bigger groups, because it can be forgotten, again it's not a crazy thing, other weapons are a lot more deadly in larger group. I said that already in my main thread. But most of the time, you're not in a larger group, you're solo or in a little groups. There are exceptions, but most of the time, most the players, in most of the guilds are on their own. So yes, 1v1 has to be considered. You can't take in consideration the 5 minutes of glory and forget the 100 hours of noobness. All has to be considered. When you farm ressources, you're on your own, as time goes you have to be in black or red to gather ressources. Yes there are strategies to reduice your loss and take less risks.
      I didn't say crossbow needed a dps buff, i mainly talked about range, and skill modifications, but not dps modifications. Some one who has played this game just a little can't deny some melee weapon have similar range effect than the "distant" dps. Like the spears family or the axes family, I won't repeat what i said about the skills that reduice the distance fast.

      Also, if people think that crossbow gives a lot of damage and take no risk, I suggest them to use diferent skills, because there are a lot of players in this game who are excellent at dealing with crossbows, and other rangers I actually wished I met in game more people who weren't that good :)
      there are some new crossbows since Brutus, but crossbows is not that much of a very popular weapon, I mean, you have to be honest, you don't meet that many crossbows, there are a lot of weapons that come before that, just like the bows family, quaterstaves, cursed staves, sickle etc.
      And for last, At the moment of the thread I play crossbow on 5.4, 5.5 and 6.3, it's not amazing but I believe it's acceptable to be able to have an opinion on the subject.

      And it's just my opinion and experience, it's ok to have a different one. I'm not judging arsh other gameplays and weapons, I'm just thinking about crossbow evolution.