Fire staff changes/rework reasonings and solutions

    • Combat Balance
    • Fire staff changes/rework reasonings and solutions

      Fire staff is proven to be extremely incapable in numerous situations in Albion online.

      One of its major limitations is that it's very slow. Fire staff is not seen often in most of the content, one of them being open-world solo PVP. The main reason why is that it has close to no mobility. Yes, soldier boot would be enough most of the time to chase a certain player, but builds like Bloodletter, Bear paws and carving swords are impossible to catch in a fair 1v1.

      Solution: In order to fix this major problem, the W spell in fire needs to have a spell that (increases your speed/slows down the enemy/stuns the enemy/ any CC)

      The other major problem (THE MOST IMPORTANT ONE) is the rework of 1h fire staff. Being one of the base weapons, 1H fire is extremely USELESS in every single content in the game now, it used to be one of the best fire staff for solo content. Since fire staff was slow in open world, 1H fire used to be able to ignore that weakness by having a long-range tracking E, which allows the user to fire its E at people that are running away, now no fire staffs are able to hit its target that is running away (unless you use fire artillery, which is also nerfed)

      Most fire staffs have a very limited range, and are bad in a lot of 1v1 situations (literally the purpose of most fire staffs), reworking the 1H fire again would fix that.

      Solution(1): Revert 1H fire to its previous state, being able to track the enemy with its E, the old 1H fire didn’t require a complete rework that ruins the entire weapon, it wasn’t that broken after all, the weapon had a lot of counter to it, and a nerf to its damage or range is sufficient enough.

      Solution(2): If it is impossible to revert 1h fire back to its previous state, at least fix the 1H fire staff, the charge time is shortened now from the last update, but after using it again, there is still no reason to use this over great fire or wildfire in any content, the MOST crucial problem is the aiming, the aim sensitivity is very slow, and making it very hard to hit the most target, making the aim sensitivity the same as the mouse would finally give the weapon some purpose, and increasing the hitbox of the E would make it much more useful.

      Solution(3): Making the 1H fire E into a spell that is like the heavy crossbow would make the staff extremely fun to play. Increasing the range and the velocity of the E by a lot, reducing the cool down of the E to close to none, and of course, reducing its damage. This solves the problem of the short-range that fire has in an open-world situation, and combining it with the third Q, would be a really good kiting weapon.

      There are so much more problems that should be fixed in the fire staff trees, but these are the most important ones. Even if any of the solutions above cannot be executed, at least buff the fire staff somehow.
    • spoken like a true fire main
      all your points are true and highlight the weaknesses of fire

      though you forgot the fact that fire does very high Single target DPS and Alot AoE dps
      with Very high numbers on E and low cooldown Q and W

      if for what ever reason mobility is taken out of the equation
      fire's numbers will be too high in any 1v1 brawler style no retreat senario

      but this game has too much mobility hence why fire feels weak and clunky
      The Tank Who Bonks
    • Fire will never be able to run down targets or really be good solo to your average player.

      HOWEVER.

      I’m having the most fun I’ve ever had with 1 handed fire. It’s not just the change to Pyroblast. Though the added range and quick cast have certainly helped.

      It’s the addition of of the Feyscale robe and Mistwalker boots allows you to do devastating lockdown to gankers that typically run you over.

      The electrical, second ability on the robe completely Stun locks a melee when they engage you, either if they don’t engage you or do, this allows you to ramp up your damage a lot easier. Once stun lock is almost over you can teleport away, and if they chase you can bounce back. Now this is the kicker, I’ve been using Stalker Helmet when they are half health + Pyroblast half quick casts that are absolutely nutty damage / instant gib vs those with similar IP.

      The Mistwalker boots + Stalker helmet really is shining for casters, we’ve never had the ability to jump in apply the debuff, hit a quick cast pyro and bounce out again. It’s been the much needed mobility and defense Fire mages have been looking for.

      Not to mention, between fire wall, the fay scale circle of fire and either the teleport or using the leather boot run speed / cd boost, you can kite entire gank squad of melees for a crazy amount of time if they haven’t come prepared with dodge abilities.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by BurnsidePDX ().

    • I have to agree Burnside, I'm just having so much fun with the one handed fire atm... it's insanely powerful, although I find the feyscale robe tricky on occasion as you can easily miss your intended option with any ping delay, so I have preferred the Cultist Robe and Helm option, with a poke and prod build.... the range with artillery, and the 3rd Q, allied with the newly improved Pyro has made for a deeply satisfying range build. Yes, they are skill shot dependent, BUT if you can hit your shots, melee are usually either dead before they even reach you or just die at your feet as you pop cultist's on them and laugh as they suicide at your feet! :D

      Also, with Mistcaller and Pork omelette, the recycle time of about 10 seconds a Pyro is crazy good. Just don't jump into melee range and expect to be utilizing the weapon class at it's best, it's a range weapon, and indeed the class is range really which is why some of the spells on the other staffs need to be looked at as their range is ludicrously short.
      50%-1sec SLOW to 'BURNING FIELD' on hit.

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Asheraxia ().

    • The_Support_God wrote:

      spoken like a true fire main
      all your points are true and highlight the weaknesses of fire

      though you forgot the fact that fire does very high Single target DPS and Alot AoE dps
      with Very high numbers on E and low cooldown Q and W

      if for what ever reason mobility is taken out of the equation
      fire's numbers will be too high in any 1v1 brawler style no retreat senario

      but this game has too much mobility hence why fire feels weak and clunky
      It does have a very high single target DPS and can win a lot of 1V1s, but it does have its fair share of weakness, for example, it can be easily countered by any reflect, as a firemain for a year, it is never that overpowered after all. from experiences with slayer cd, and a lot of duels, i can conclude that it is only really good against people that are new to the game, or dont understand fire, against ANY good player, and they will spot the weakness of fire, and abuse it.
    • BurnsidePDX wrote:

      Fire will never be able to run down targets or really be good solo to your average player.

      HOWEVER.

      I’m having the most fun I’ve ever had with 1 handed fire. It’s not just the change to Pyroblast. Though the added range and quick cast have certainly helped.

      It’s the addition of of the Feyscale robe and Mistwalker boots allows you to do devastating lockdown to gankers that typically run you over.

      The electrical, second ability on the robe completely Stun locks a melee when they engage you, either if they don’t engage you or do, this allows you to ramp up your damage a lot easier. Once stun lock is almost over you can teleport away, and if they chase you can bounce back. Now this is the kicker, I’ve been using Stalker Helmet when they are half health + Pyroblast half quick casts that are absolutely nutty damage / instant gib vs those with similar IP.

      The Mistwalker boots + Stalker helmet really is shining for casters, we’ve never had the ability to jump in apply the debuff, hit a quick cast pyro and bounce out again. It’s been the much needed mobility and defense Fire mages have been looking for.

      Not to mention, between fire wall, the fay scale circle of fire and either the teleport or using the leather boot run speed / cd boost, you can kite entire gank squad of melees for a crazy amount of time if they haven’t come prepared with dodge abilities.
      With over 80% of my play time being a firemain, and countless duels and cd, i can say that 1H fire is absolute dogshit. Tested it against many builds and players, the E is so easily dodgeable against any experienced player, it became almost impossible to hit any target unless they are standings still, any player who has a normal reaction speed can just walk away or cancel channeling or use defense against it, there is absolutely NO REASON to use it over wildfire or great fire, and these 2 staffs is already very underpowered. It wouldnt be fun at all when people will dodge every single one of your E, and this is not a matter of aim, its just way too easy to dodge. Even with the old 1H fire, its lock on E is very easy to block/dodge/reflected, thats why it is not very popular in corrupted dungeon slayer, as it's weakness is huge. And the staff isn't that fun to play anyways, if you find 1H fire very fun. that means you haven't used great fire staff, that staff is what i use when i am bored as it is extremely fun and also much stronger than 1H fire
    • 1h fire is the best fire for 5s content now so its definitely not useless
      surprise surprise the 1.2s cast time ability isnt great in 1v1s
      the turn aiming mechanic is just frustratingly pointless though, they should remove that

      for the rest of the fire line you could slap a slow on Q2, W1, or W4
      infernal could use some trail width / damage buffs as well

      generally I think they're in a pretty good spot right now (especially compared to frost LOL)
      ~ Kanra
    • Becaculas wrote:

      BurnsidePDX wrote:

      Fire will never be able to run down targets or really be good solo to your average player.

      HOWEVER.

      I’m having the most fun I’ve ever had with 1 handed fire. It’s not just the change to Pyroblast. Though the added range and quick cast have certainly helped.

      It’s the addition of of the Feyscale robe and Mistwalker boots allows you to do devastating lockdown to gankers that typically run you over.

      The electrical, second ability on the robe completely Stun locks a melee when they engage you, either if they don’t engage you or do, this allows you to ramp up your damage a lot easier. Once stun lock is almost over you can teleport away, and if they chase you can bounce back. Now this is the kicker, I’ve been using Stalker Helmet when they are half health + Pyroblast half quick casts that are absolutely nutty damage / instant gib vs those with similar IP.

      The Mistwalker boots + Stalker helmet really is shining for casters, we’ve never had the ability to jump in apply the debuff, hit a quick cast pyro and bounce out again. It’s been the much needed mobility and defense Fire mages have been looking for.

      Not to mention, between fire wall, the fay scale circle of fire and either the teleport or using the leather boot run speed / cd boost, you can kite entire gank squad of melees for a crazy amount of time if they haven’t come prepared with dodge abilities.
      With over 80% of my play time being a firemain, and countless duels and cd, i can say that 1H fire is absolute dogshit. Tested it against many builds and players, the E is so easily dodgeable against any experienced player, it became almost impossible to hit any target unless they are standings still, any player who has a normal reaction speed can just walk away or cancel channeling or use defense against it, there is absolutely NO REASON to use it over wildfire or great fire, and these 2 staffs is already very underpowered. It wouldnt be fun at all when people will dodge every single one of your E, and this is not a matter of aim, its just way too easy to dodge. Even with the old 1H fire, its lock on E is very easy to block/dodge/reflected, thats why it is not very popular in corrupted dungeon slayer, as it's weakness is huge. And the staff isn't that fun to play anyways, if you find 1H fire very fun. that means you haven't used great fire staff, that staff is what i use when i am bored as it is extremely fun and also much stronger than 1H fire
      Come add me BurnsidePDX ingame. Let’s play a few crystals together and maybe get some OW going. I’ll show you how to work 1H fire now. It should not be a full build up unless it’s for initial poke or you’re offscreen from your target. 90% of my pyros are .6 casts with a stalker helm debuff running on the target.

      I safely say I can beat any other class one on one in crystals in the 3000+ range and I’m usually the 2 point holder. Mistwalker boots was the key to beat very good brawler gloves as you can now dodge their initial engages and secondary engages if they commit (and you’re quick as hell). A top tier bow user is challenge but chances are you can do a cap node / object LoS kite and poke with artillery and a quick cast Pyroblasts.

      The feyscale robe is a high skill cap item with huge potential. You should not be using the robe and let it just be cycling through over and over. You break it down the scenarios you need to use it in 99% of cases and how to identify those with situational awareness. Plus it’s on a *30 second timer* and it counts as 2 spells when used in quick succession towards the aggressive caster buff. This is very important for Fire bolt dumps.

      If you’re running and you got a pack on you and it’s only solely being used for escape or peel of another target - immediate activate the robe and hit it again and you will quick cast a circle of fire and keep running. I do this all the time to run away from a pack or offer a peel to our healer.

      If you can anticipate an engagement / switch to you directly and it’s going to be a fight, activate the robe as you notice the shift to you (melees running at you) so it will be ready to activate electrical by the time they get to you . 1on1 I force the engagement via artilllary and then immediately activate the robe for cycle when I see them commit. This takes situation awareness but DOES get easier with time. Why is the electrical so good? Complete 5 second stun lock + resistances + damage if they continue to damage you. PRO tip: If you activate this with any enemy hellion jacket or stalker jacket running in your proximity it will completely stunlock the user for the entire duration of their buff. I’ve frozen an entire enemy melee train for 5 seconds. Using the electrical stun lock + artillery pools is devastating to any attacker.

      I only really use the frozen fragments if I need to quick kill a annoying solo tank or healer that is camping a node. I rarely use this in group combat as peels and defenses are the most important thing to a fire mage.

      Pyroblast. I can’t say it enough, look at the potential the electrical robe has with initial engagements? Chances are you can get a target to half health between it, artillery poles and fire bolts. Throw in a quick stalker helm debuff on that poor melee that thought that it’s now his time to dps with him already at 50% and quick cast a pyro (not full wind up) and watch his health melt.

      I haven’t even talked about throwing in mist walker boots for some quick kiting or bounce forward and back with pokes in combination with getting more comfortable with the feyscale / stalker helm use and it gets crazy with high skill caps.

      You see a healer at less than 50%? You can now teleport to him point blank and immediately activate stalker helm debuff and unload an instant cast pyro and bounce back to avoid over extending all within 2 seconds. Stalker helm against cloth drops the target to about ~15% damage reduction in crystals. To put the damage in perspective for an average Crystal IP fire staff (1050 ip), that little 700 damage quick / instant cast pyro + 90% damage buff (~75% from gear, 15% from helmet) is 1,130 instant damage or roughly 50% of their total pool at that IP… which if they are at 50% it’s usually death. You couldn’t do this safely before with teleport boots as it would leave you over exposed. But with bounce back option it opens so many more aggressive plays.

      1 hand fire mages that are played by high skill cap players that know positioning are going to be an absolute terror as the mistwalker teleport + stalker helm + instant pyro is a brutal dps drop that is up every *15 seconds*. Pyro and stalker helm are the same cd. with mistwalker being up every 20 and feyscsle robe at 30. It’s a lot of fun coming from a previous play style that involves long cool downs and face tanking.

      The post was edited 3 times, last by BurnsidePDX ().

    • BurnsidePDX wrote:

      Becaculas wrote:

      BurnsidePDX wrote:

      Fire will never be able to run down targets or really be good solo to your average player.

      HOWEVER.

      I’m having the most fun I’ve ever had with 1 handed fire. It’s not just the change to Pyroblast. Though the added range and quick cast have certainly helped.

      It’s the addition of of the Feyscale robe and Mistwalker boots allows you to do devastating lockdown to gankers that typically run you over.

      The electrical, second ability on the robe completely Stun locks a melee when they engage you, either if they don’t engage you or do, this allows you to ramp up your damage a lot easier. Once stun lock is almost over you can teleport away, and if they chase you can bounce back. Now this is the kicker, I’ve been using Stalker Helmet when they are half health + Pyroblast half quick casts that are absolutely nutty damage / instant gib vs those with similar IP.

      The Mistwalker boots + Stalker helmet really is shining for casters, we’ve never had the ability to jump in apply the debuff, hit a quick cast pyro and bounce out again. It’s been the much needed mobility and defense Fire mages have been looking for.

      Not to mention, between fire wall, the fay scale circle of fire and either the teleport or using the leather boot run speed / cd boost, you can kite entire gank squad of melees for a crazy amount of time if they haven’t come prepared with dodge abilities.
      With over 80% of my play time being a firemain, and countless duels and cd, i can say that 1H fire is absolute dogshit. Tested it against many builds and players, the E is so easily dodgeable against any experienced player, it became almost impossible to hit any target unless they are standings still, any player who has a normal reaction speed can just walk away or cancel channeling or use defense against it, there is absolutely NO REASON to use it over wildfire or great fire, and these 2 staffs is already very underpowered. It wouldnt be fun at all when people will dodge every single one of your E, and this is not a matter of aim, its just way too easy to dodge. Even with the old 1H fire, its lock on E is very easy to block/dodge/reflected, thats why it is not very popular in corrupted dungeon slayer, as it's weakness is huge. And the staff isn't that fun to play anyways, if you find 1H fire very fun. that means you haven't used great fire staff, that staff is what i use when i am bored as it is extremely fun and also much stronger than 1H fire
      Come add me BurnsidePDX ingame. Let’s play a few crystals together and maybe get some OW going. I’ll show you how to work 1H fire now. It should not be a full build up unless it’s for initial poke or you’re offscreen from your target. 90% of my pyros are .6 casts with a stalker helm debuff running on the target.
      I safely say I can beat any other class one on one in crystals in the 3000+ range and I’m usually the 2 point holder. Mistwalker boots was the key to beat very good brawler gloves as you can now dodge their initial engages and secondary engages if they commit (and you’re quick as hell). A top tier bow user is challenge but chances are you can do a cap node / object LoS kite and poke with artillery and a quick cast Pyroblasts.

      The feyscale robe is a high skill cap item with huge potential. You should not be using the robe and let it just be cycling through over and over. You break it down the scenarios you need to use it in 99% of cases and how to identify those with situational awareness. Plus it’s on a *30 second timer* and it counts as 2 spells when used in quick succession towards the aggressive caster buff. This is very important for Fire bolt dumps.

      If you’re running and you got a pack on you and it’s only solely being used for escape or peel of another target - immediate activate the robe and hit it again and you will quick cast a circle of fire and keep running. I do this all the time to run away from a pack or offer a peel to our healer.

      If you can anticipate an engagement / switch to you directly and it’s going to be a fight, activate the robe as you notice the shift to you (melees running at you) so it will be ready to activate electrical by the time they get to you . 1on1 I force the engagement via artilllary and then immediately activate the robe for cycle when I see them commit. This takes situation awareness but DOES get easier with time. Why is the electrical so good? Complete 5 second stun lock + resistances + damage if they continue to damage you. PRO tip: If you activate this with any enemy hellion jacket or stalker jacket running in your proximity it will completely stunlock the user for the entire duration of their buff. I’ve frozen an entire enemy melee train for 5 seconds. Using the electrical stun lock + artillery pools is devastating to any attacker.

      I only really use the frozen fragments if I need to quick kill a annoying solo tank or healer that is camping a node. I rarely use this in group combat as peels and defenses are the most important thing to a fire mage.

      Pyroblast. I can’t say it enough, look at the potential the electrical robe has with initial engagements? Chances are you can get a target to half health between it, artillery poles and fire bolts. Throw in a quick stalker helm debuff on that poor melee that thought that it’s now his time to dps with him already at 50% and quick cast a pyro (not full wind up) and watch his health melt.

      I haven’t even talked about throwing in mist walker boots for some quick kiting or bounce forward and back with pokes in combination with getting more comfortable with the feyscale / stalker helm use and it gets crazy with high skill caps.

      You see a healer at less than 50%? You can now teleport to him point blank and immediately activate stalker helm debuff and unload an instant cast pyro and bounce back to avoid over extending all within 2 seconds. Stalker helm against cloth drops the target to about ~15% damage reduction in crystals. To put the damage in perspective for an average Crystal IP fire staff (1050 ip), that little 700 damage quick / instant cast pyro + 90% damage buff (~75% from gear, 15% from helmet) is 1,130 instant damage or roughly 50% of their total pool at that IP… which if they are at 50% it’s usually death. You couldn’t do this safely before with teleport boots as it would leave you over exposed. But with bounce back option it opens so many more aggressive plays.

      1 hand fire mages that are played by high skill cap players that know positioning are going to be an absolute terror as the mistwalker teleport + stalker helm + instant pyro is a brutal dps drop that is up every *15 seconds*. Pyro and stalker helm are the same cd. with mistwalker being up every 20 and feyscsle robe at 30. It’s a lot of fun coming from a previous play style that involves long cool downs and face tanking.
      I dont do crystals, so i can't say anything, as i mainly do large scale zvz, some small scale brawling and mostly solo content such as mist, cd and duel. But sure, my IGN is Katsku, i dont play much anymore since 1H fire got reworked, but we could do some crystals, 1v1 or open world. But the purpose of this post is so that SBI could change/ fix the 1H fire and other firestaffs, and my point still stands, idk if you ever used the old 1H fire or not, but it was my favorate weapon after the wildfire nerf, i have almost 300 kills with that weapon alone purely from solo content. I am just sad and frustrated that SBI took something valueable from me for no reason.

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Becaculas ().