Nerf Bow

    • Ayi true true.

      then what is stopping frost from running with their superior cc if they miss their "chance"
      or running purge? since you are relying on mostly E to do damage

      also frost nova is just a better version of frost shot no matter how you look at at it. in

      while reg bow does not suffer as much from silence but it suffers from purge while frost is the opposite it suffers from silence but not as much from purge

      as for bolts and hammer/mace using frost to avoid can potentialy outplay but lets face it frost nova of frost tree is instant unlike frost shot so skill is required

      so its still considered balanced.
      at least when compared to pre nerf nature and "hallowfall" holy
      https://forum.albiononline.com/index.php/Thread/154632-Put-more-Static-Solo-Random-dungeons-in-roads-of-avalon/

      take a look in the thread above and give your likes and comment to make this a reality
    • The_Support_God wrote:

      also frost nova is just a better version of frost shot no matter how you look at at it. in

      Hattenhair wrote:

      Distance covered in 60s with 4 Frost shots:
      If not hitting the slow: 4 13m dashes with 0.7s of being locked into casts and animation (52m - 15.4m for animation/cast time) = 36.6m of generated distance.
      If hitting the slow (~1k IP bow/leather armor with 40% ~7s slow duration and ~56% CC resist, 10% CC dur bonus) + additional 2.2m for 3.38s times 4 casts = 29.74m (66.36m total).
      Ill take the wiki data cause i'm lazy this time:

      5.5m/s default movespeed;
      10% CC dur bonus for Assassin jacket;
      3 frost shots in 60 seconds;
      Not hitting the stun: 3 11m leaps with ~0.2s being locked into the animation = 33m - 3.3m in animation = 29.7mpm.
      Hitting the stun: (1.75*1.1)*(1-0.56)*5.5*3 = 14mpm(round up) + 29.7mpm = 43.9mpm.

      On its own Frost nova is mediocre at best and is beaten by fucking deadly swipe mobility-wise any time of the day, yet its another thing that frost has 2 other skills in his kit that have CC providing kiting potential. The other thing being that FN is a 20s cooldown spell thus benefits more from coodown rate buffs.

      Also: the frost shot does not slow the target at cast point, but rather leaves a slowing area which applies the slowing debuff, which lasts ~0.5 to 1s after cast, the same way FN used to behave before the fix.
      - You're a monster.
      - Am I?

      The post was edited 4 times, last by Hattenhair: fixed anim time for FS ().

    • PaladinJavier wrote:

      Zentiic wrote:

      BraveArt wrote:

      No mobility?? We’re you on crack when you wrote this
      I think he means to say they have no mobility if their on there turret setup (explosive arrows), kite bow has considerably more mobility (frost shot) but also lack in damage compared to let's say morgana cape active frost or light crossbow.Reason bow isn't very good is because it has alot of hard counters. In that way it's sort of a coin flip witch isn't great game design but to be fair all it has is damage. No utility just damage. Nerf that and the weapon becomes useless.
      yo, kite bow and turret bow have same mobility rofl.
      No they don't. One uses a mobility W others uses explosive arrows. How do they have the same mobility wtf?
      All the noobs turn into savants when they get to the balance thread.
    • @Trial_hard

      you got a bone to pick with me?

      i said thanks for the numbers because he @Hattenhair gave more accurate info than you ever have even for me
      it shows i acknowledge his effort to pull up data and calculate numbers

      but those numbers only indicate distance traveled or "distance gained" with frost nova and frost shot in absolute ideal conditions
      it does not take into account frost nova's ease of use, i-frame potential, over all kit loaded with cc and respectable base damage "not affected by purge"

      frost arrow, has a cast time, player travel time, can be cc in the air, can be damaged while in the air, time taken to move mouse to opposite site of screen.
      not to mention higher skill required because you moving backwards from your mouse so no accurate pin point jumps.

      those factors were not taken into his consideration
      https://forum.albiononline.com/index.php/Thread/154632-Put-more-Static-Solo-Random-dungeons-in-roads-of-avalon/

      take a look in the thread above and give your likes and comment to make this a reality
    • Zentiic wrote:

      PaladinJavier wrote:

      Zentiic wrote:

      BraveArt wrote:

      No mobility?? We’re you on crack when you wrote this
      I think he means to say they have no mobility if their on there turret setup (explosive arrows), kite bow has considerably more mobility (frost shot) but also lack in damage compared to let's say morgana cape active frost or light crossbow.Reason bow isn't very good is because it has alot of hard counters. In that way it's sort of a coin flip witch isn't great game design but to be fair all it has is damage. No utility just damage. Nerf that and the weapon becomes useless.
      yo, kite bow and turret bow have same mobility rofl.
      No they don't. One uses a mobility W others uses explosive arrows. How do they have the same mobility wtf?
      the mobility in this case (frost shot) is a W so all bows can use it. what differs is the playstyle.
    • @PaladinJavier

      you do know that explosive arrows is one of the few W in the game that can reach over 1k base damage? that's basically 1/3 of bow's damage output for the first 6 shots of reg bow before it ramps up with the resist shred

      in cd it is reduced to about 800 damage over 10 arrows and this is compared to 500-600 damage that most other W in the other weapon line has
      one of the few things that do more damage than this would be curse' grudge, mace ground shaker, hammer's heavy strike, fire's fire artillery and few others

      but those skills are rarely used as "first choice" because they would use the weapon's mobility skill such as snaring charge, slowing charge, fire wall, frost nova, decerate

      taking frost shot means giving up alot of damage reg bow can have. if we talk about warbow/badon explosive arrow does not give enough value as it cannot be activated fast enough/ does not fit into play style

      but when reg bow takes explosive arrows it means he will stand his ground and fight. the outcome should be clear that reg bow dominates single target damage when the other side does not run and does not have purge

      in exchange of the stupid amounts reg bow can output with explosive arrows they have 0 mobility
      https://forum.albiononline.com/index.php/Thread/154632-Put-more-Static-Solo-Random-dungeons-in-roads-of-avalon/

      take a look in the thread above and give your likes and comment to make this a reality
    • The_Support_God wrote:

      frost arrow, has a cast time, player travel time,
      That's taken into account for mobility, actually (About 0.6s-0.7s for both cast and animation time). Blinks are not instant, they are about 0,2s of animation, which is also taken into account.

      Besides FN is an AoE stun which can be comboed into from frost's own kit, considering how much CC the weapon has. I wouldnt use FS for teamfights, besides maybe with a mistpiercer on ZvZ which cannot benefit from explosive arrows and survivability is more of a concern over additional damage/CC like Ray of light.

      P.S. The numbers for FS were a little off, so the mpm is slightly less than i first calculated.
      - You're a monster.
      - Am I?

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Hattenhair ().

    • PaladinJavier wrote:

      Zentiic wrote:

      PaladinJavier wrote:

      Zentiic wrote:

      BraveArt wrote:

      No mobility?? We’re you on crack when you wrote this
      I think he means to say they have no mobility if their on there turret setup (explosive arrows), kite bow has considerably more mobility (frost shot) but also lack in damage compared to let's say morgana cape active frost or light crossbow.Reason bow isn't very good is because it has alot of hard counters. In that way it's sort of a coin flip witch isn't great game design but to be fair all it has is damage. No utility just damage. Nerf that and the weapon becomes useless.
      yo, kite bow and turret bow have same mobility rofl.
      No they don't. One uses a mobility W others uses explosive arrows. How do they have the same mobility wtf?
      the mobility in this case (frost shot) is a W so all bows can use it. what differs is the playstyle.
      I know...... that's why I said kite and turret bow are different.
      All the noobs turn into savants when they get to the balance thread.
    • Reg bow turret has 2 buff like skills which need at least 6 autos to deal enough damage to be on par with other weapon W and E skills
      and it at least take 3-5 seconds to unload unlike other weapon skills which are instant/ near instant cast

      the problem where most players hate about reg bow is that if there is no purge or defensives bow can pre stack this 2 buffs 10 seconds before the fight
      deal damage then recast the skills to get more value out of it

      where most sustain dps run out of mana such as Q3 frost or cooldowns in the case of axe/curse, reg bow can still sustain top damage 30 autos in
      and this is considering the ideal scenario where there is no purge and the other guy does not run away

      of course when purge is involved a bow would be useless for 20 seconds and most of the time the fights would be concluded by then
      https://forum.albiononline.com/index.php/Thread/154632-Put-more-Static-Solo-Random-dungeons-in-roads-of-avalon/

      take a look in the thread above and give your likes and comment to make this a reality
    • XITREALITY wrote:

      imagine calling to nerf bow if you have one single purge on your team bow is useless.. I stopped playing bow because it's useless right now in the meta you are constantly purged
      Not really. Still meta in 5v5s/10v10s/20v20s. You can i-frame purges if you have good reaction time, and can run assassin hood to get your E back faster.

      Most players don't even know how to properly manage their stacks. It's still quite good just less consistent then let's say a light crossbow.
      All the noobs turn into savants when they get to the balance thread.
    • in a pure stand off light xbow is more vunerable to silence and i-frames then reg bow

      light xbow or xbows in general plays a very bursty style of constant dps.

      sure they deal respectable damage with Q1 and Q2 but their kill combo is loaded onto their W-E combo which can be i-framed/ defenses used

      most xbows dont auto as much when compared to other ranged

      meanwhile reg bows are not affected much by iframe defenses but are shutdown by purge

      if you want the best of both worlds then curse would be the next runner up with the grudge ability. that thing hits like a truck at 6 autos dealing over 1k damage over 8 seconds once fully stacked
      https://forum.albiononline.com/index.php/Thread/154632-Put-more-Static-Solo-Random-dungeons-in-roads-of-avalon/

      take a look in the thread above and give your likes and comment to make this a reality
    • The_Support_God wrote:

      sure they deal respectable damage with Q1 and Q2 but their kill combo is loaded onto their W-E combo which can be i-framed/ defenses used
      I meant the fact that in 5v5s cGvG, a backline light crossbow will spend the whole time outputting DPS from their Q and forcing rolls with their pierce + E. Off course they have the issue of channel time for damage witch is why in the current great hammer tank meta they aren't played much as it's impossible to match damage.

      Just wanted to point out that a light crossbow will deal reasonable damage without the worry over purges.
      All the noobs turn into savants when they get to the balance thread.
    • The_Support_God wrote:

      @PaladinJavier

      you do know that explosive arrows is one of the few W in the game that can reach over 1k base damage? that's basically 1/3 of bow's damage output for the first 6 shots of reg bow before it ramps up with the resist shred

      in cd it is reduced to about 800 damage over 10 arrows and this is compared to 500-600 damage that most other W in the other weapon line has
      one of the few things that do more damage than this would be curse' grudge, mace ground shaker, hammer's heavy strike, fire's fire artillery and few others

      but those skills are rarely used as "first choice" because they would use the weapon's mobility skill such as snaring charge, slowing charge, fire wall, frost nova, decerate

      taking frost shot means giving up alot of damage reg bow can have. if we talk about warbow/badon explosive arrow does not give enough value as it cannot be activated fast enough/ does not fit into play style

      but when reg bow takes explosive arrows it means he will stand his ground and fight. the outcome should be clear that reg bow dominates single target damage when the other side does not run and does not have purge

      in exchange of the stupid amounts reg bow can output with explosive arrows they have 0 mobility
      SO what? Damage is brutal only by E. I don't know how You enjoy a SO dumb gameplay. Playing turret with frost shot is pretty factible to melt melees.

      I dunno why Sbi keep this gameplay that is not balanced at all.
      Someone wrote about crossbow. Their damage is way tankier than bolw cause at least I can catch them and interrupt is more common at weapons than damn purge.
    • It needs a nerf in some shape or form 100%. I run from bows these days in CD. They have a 15k build in stalker against your 200k build and don't even have a skill shot. If you don't run a purge you are 100% dead.. The problem with that situation is there are only 2 affordable purge items available and to pigeon hole a player into those 2 items is bad for the game and the economy.. i play swords and either have to run fiend cowl or run from bows.. i'm never running mage robe so for me i HAVE to play fiend cowl to fight bow which is pathetic design flaw. Either change the way bow works or make dispel option generic to 1 of the helm types.

      My fix idea would be remove HOWL from leather helmets as i have never seen this spell used and i mean NEVER and replace it with a AOE Slow & purge. Now we can buy something other than fiend cowl and actually fight bows without nerfing the Bow E

      Edit: As for fiend cowl give it good range on the purge while the howl replacement purge would be a low range aoe so it only worked for melee type engagements. This would stop the stand still, switch brain functions off bow play

      The post was edited 1 time, last by BraveArt ().