Are the 2v2s in its final state? I really hope not...

    • Hellgates

    This site uses cookies. By continuing to browse this site, you are agreeing to our Cookie Policy.

    • Vocandin wrote:

      Seldom wrote:

      We are currently testing with an 80% cap in lethal 2v2 and 5v5.
      The idea is to get the balance just right, to get good fights and not make the entry-level too high for newer players.
      Below you find the current setup, but as always this is all something we will tinker with according to player feedback and the data that we can collect :)

      Ip requirement, caps, scaling, mob tier
      • Nonlethal
        • Hellgate 2v2 Nonlethal: 800ip requirement, 900ip cap, 90% scaling, T5 mobs
        • Hellgate 2v2 Nonlethal: 800ip requirement, 900ip cap, 90% scaling, T5 mobs
        • Hellgate 2v2 Nonlethal: 800ip requirement, 900ip cap, 90% scaling, T5 mobs
      • Lethal
        • Hellgate 2v2 Nonlethal: 900ip requirement, 1100ip cap, 80% scaling, T6 mobs
        • Hellgate 2v2 Nonlethal: 1000ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 80% scaling, T7 mobs
        • Hellgate 2v2 Nonlethal: 1100ip requirement, 1300ip cap, 50% scaling, T8 mobs
      Hope this could help a bit,
      Friendly Greetings,
      Dom
      I assume you meant 2v2, 5v5 and 10v10 in those. With that said:
      • Aren't all other soft-caps currently 80% or 50%? Why introduce yet another tier of soft-cap?
      • 2v2 and 5v5 HGs as of now rarely share the community, as many focus only on one or the other, it seems you guys are trying to use it as a ladder (start on 2v2s and move up) but it doesn't work like this
      • Why can't all HG sizes share same IP cap, 1000 IP with a 50% scaling seems to have worked well as most people run 6.1 Overcharge with IMO is a healthy spot between good gear and stuff you can't be bothered to loot. And also a good spot between being full of "rats" and 8.3 gear crutchers.

      @Seldom would really appreciate a response to this and I'd like to add to it.

      I assumed hellgate ritual keys were different tiers just because, rather than matching the tier of mobs found within. This means you guys are really looking into hellgates as a "Size = Difficulty" mindset, which I think will make people very unhappy.

      Once again, as of now, there's whole communities dedicated to 2v2 HGs and some to only 5v5 HGs, and they are happy as is since some people prefer to play with just one person at a time while others enjoy joining with new people to do 5v5s or got a set team.

      Based on what you said, rewards for 2v2 will be awful, coupled with the low IP cap, it means you really are getting nothing out of it compared to 10v10 which has T8 nobs, and in consequence, a T8 loot pool, alongside higher fame, and the loot from killing enemy team with a much higher IP cap.

      I really think hellgates should be more on par with corrupteds. Where:
      • Non-lethal = Hunter / T5
      • Lethal 1 = Stalker / T6
      • Lethal 2 = Slayer / T8
      Obviously this would split the matchup pool even more, so if that's an issue, then please just normalize the tier and IP cap across ALL hellgate types, this way everyone is getting "equal" rewards doing the size of hellgates they want, rather than being "forced" into 10v10s and out of 2v2s to get a decent return of investment.

    • I like the way you are thinking, and we are thinking in the same-ish direction.
      Always keep in mind that these numbers are there to be tested for now on the test server.

      Basically what we are taking into consideration is the difference in the difficulty of creating a 5v5 or a 10v10 team compared to a 2v2 team.
      As it is quite a bit harder to create a 5v5 team and even harder to create a 10v10 team the incentive must give an edge to 5v5 and 10v10.
      Additionally, the skillsets are also hard to compare between these different modes, but the general idea is that there is a higher skill cap the more players are involved.

      You are right that there are whole communities based around 2v2s and 5v5s but if 10v10 and 5v5s don't outshine 2v2, the vast majority will not even consider to use or try the other modes as it will be equally as beneficial to just play a 2v2 hellgate with my buddy.

      But yeah, I just want to emphasize that you make a very good point, and splitting the match pool is a great concern to us but if we will find that players correspond in certain ways we are very willing to adjust the numbers :)

      I hope that makes a few things clearer,
      Greetings,
      Dom

    • Seldom wrote:

      I like the way you are thinking, and we are thinking in the same-ish direction.
      Always keep in mind that these numbers are there to be tested for now on the test server.

      Basically what we are taking into consideration is the difference in the difficulty of creating a 5v5 or a 10v10 team compared to a 2v2 team.
      As it is quite a bit harder to create a 5v5 team and even harder to create a 10v10 team the incentive must give an edge to 5v5 and 10v10.
      Additionally, the skillsets are also hard to compare between these different modes, but the general idea is that there is a higher skill cap the more players are involved.

      You are right that there are whole communities based around 2v2s and 5v5s but if 10v10 and 5v5s don't outshine 2v2, the vast majority will not even consider to use or try the other modes as it will be equally as beneficial to just play a 2v2 hellgate with my buddy.

      But yeah, I just want to emphasize that you make a very good point, and splitting the match pool is a great concern to us but if we will find that players correspond in certain ways we are very willing to adjust the numbers :)

      I hope that makes a few things clearer,
      Greetings,
      Dom
      Appreciate the reply!

      It is important to note that hell gate wise, 2v2's have always been the most competitive with the biggest community around it. The reason people are unhappy is because these communities have been waiting for years to have an official ranking system to rank their skill and expertise. From our perspective, 2v2's are no different to corrupted dungeons with the only difference being a ranking system.

      In fact I would probably argue a 10v10 hellgate group requiring less skill then 2v2 or 5v5 (besides of course getting 10 people together).
      This is due to the comps and tactics that will probably be used in 10v10 making it quite simple.

      Also I would argue the less people a content needs the higher the bar of entry and skill gap exists.
      Example :
      • A higher barrier of entry : except if a experienced player is willing to mentor a newer player, its extremely difficult to improve or get on par with players who have been perfecting strategies for years. Mentoring newer players in 2v2 happens really rarely, almost no-one is willing to sacrifice weeks trying to guide a new player and also losing a lot of silver in the process. The opposite is true for 5v5. When I was still GM, we would make 5v5 groups each with 3 experienced players and 2 newer players, and this would work out quite effectively in teaching newer players, the 3 experienced players would be able to carry the other 2 a lot of the time teaching them in the process.

        I just feel the correlation between more players = more skill isn't entirely accurate.



    • Seldom wrote:

      I like the way you are thinking, and we are thinking in the same-ish direction.
      Always keep in mind that these numbers are there to be tested for now on the test server.

      Basically what we are taking into consideration is the difference in the difficulty of creating a 5v5 or a 10v10 team compared to a 2v2 team.
      As it is quite a bit harder to create a 5v5 team and even harder to create a 10v10 team the incentive must give an edge to 5v5 and 10v10.
      Additionally, the skillsets are also hard to compare between these different modes, but the general idea is that there is a higher skill cap the more players are involved.

      You are right that there are whole communities based around 2v2s and 5v5s but if 10v10 and 5v5s don't outshine 2v2, the vast majority will not even consider to use or try the other modes as it will be equally as beneficial to just play a 2v2 hellgate with my buddy.

      But yeah, I just want to emphasize that you make a very good point, and splitting the match pool is a great concern to us but if we will find that players correspond in certain ways we are very willing to adjust the numbers :)

      I hope that makes a few things clearer,
      Greetings,
      Dom

      wolfo70 wrote:

      Seldom wrote:

      ...
      Appreciate the reply!
      It is important to note that hell gate wise, 2v2's have always been the most competitive with the biggest community around it. The reason people are unhappy is because these communities have been waiting for years to have an official ranking system to rank their skill and expertise. From our perspective, 2v2's are no different to corrupted dungeons with the only difference being a ranking system.

      In fact I would probably argue a 10v10 hellgate group requiring less skill then 2v2 or 5v5 (besides of course getting 10 people together).
      This is due to the comps and tactics that will probably be used in 10v10 making it quite simple.

      Also I would argue the less people a content needs the higher the bar of entry and skill gap exists.
      Example :
      • A higher barrier of entry : except if a experienced player is willing to mentor a newer player, its extremely difficult to improve or get on par with players who have been perfecting strategies for years. Mentoring newer players in 2v2 happens really rarely, almost no-one is willing to sacrifice weeks trying to guide a new player and also losing a lot of silver in the process. The opposite is true for 5v5. When I was still GM, we would make 5v5 groups each with 3 experienced players and 2 newer players, and this would work out quite effectively in teaching newer players, the 3 experienced players would be able to carry the other 2 a lot of the time teaching them in the process.

        I just feel the correlation between more players = more skill isn't entirely accurate.

      Wolfo really nails in on how HGs work in action rather than on paper, 2v2s are by far much more competitive, and I'd argue that individual skill matters much more the less players you have rather than the other way, adding more people just allows for more mistakes to be made most of the time as people make up for each other's mistakes.

      I really appreciate the response and I'm glad you can see our point on this matter. I hope in the end you guys make the right decision as I'd hate to see Hellgates, which were on the backburner for so long, get an update only for it to be a let down.

      New map layouts, requiring always a full party, chaining hellgates, hellgate map spawning. All these are amazing changes, you just really gotta get the IP cap and rewards balanced so everyone is happy, and unfortunately I can't see that happening if you guys go with the current numbers.

    • Vocandin wrote:

      Seldom wrote:

      I like the way you are thinking, and we are thinking in the same-ish direction.
      Always keep in mind that these numbers are there to be tested for now on the test server.

      Basically what we are taking into consideration is the difference in the difficulty of creating a 5v5 or a 10v10 team compared to a 2v2 team.
      As it is quite a bit harder to create a 5v5 team and even harder to create a 10v10 team the incentive must give an edge to 5v5 and 10v10.
      Additionally, the skillsets are also hard to compare between these different modes, but the general idea is that there is a higher skill cap the more players are involved.

      You are right that there are whole communities based around 2v2s and 5v5s but if 10v10 and 5v5s don't outshine 2v2, the vast majority will not even consider to use or try the other modes as it will be equally as beneficial to just play a 2v2 hellgate with my buddy.

      But yeah, I just want to emphasize that you make a very good point, and splitting the match pool is a great concern to us but if we will find that players correspond in certain ways we are very willing to adjust the numbers :)

      I hope that makes a few things clearer,
      Greetings,
      Dom

      wolfo70 wrote:

      Seldom wrote:

      ...
      Appreciate the reply!It is important to note that hell gate wise, 2v2's have always been the most competitive with the biggest community around it. The reason people are unhappy is because these communities have been waiting for years to have an official ranking system to rank their skill and expertise. From our perspective, 2v2's are no different to corrupted dungeons with the only difference being a ranking system.

      In fact I would probably argue a 10v10 hellgate group requiring less skill then 2v2 or 5v5 (besides of course getting 10 people together).
      This is due to the comps and tactics that will probably be used in 10v10 making it quite simple.

      Also I would argue the less people a content needs the higher the bar of entry and skill gap exists.
      Example :
      • A higher barrier of entry : except if a experienced player is willing to mentor a newer player, its extremely difficult to improve or get on par with players who have been perfecting strategies for years. Mentoring newer players in 2v2 happens really rarely, almost no-one is willing to sacrifice weeks trying to guide a new player and also losing a lot of silver in the process. The opposite is true for 5v5. When I was still GM, we would make 5v5 groups each with 3 experienced players and 2 newer players, and this would work out quite effectively in teaching newer players, the 3 experienced players would be able to carry the other 2 a lot of the time teaching them in the process.

        I just feel the correlation between more players = more skill isn't entirely accurate.

      Wolfo really nails in on how HGs work in action rather than on paper, 2v2s are by far much more competitive, and I'd argue that individual skill matters much more the less players you have rather than the other way, adding more people just allows for more mistakes to be made most of the time as people make up for each other's mistakes.
      I really appreciate the response and I'm glad you can see our point on this matter. I hope in the end you guys make the right decision as I'd hate to see Hellgates, which were on the backburner for so long, get an update only for it to be a let down.

      New map layouts, requiring always a full party, chaining hellgates, hellgate map spawning. All these are amazing changes, you just really gotta get the IP cap and rewards balanced so everyone is happy, and unfortunately I can't see that happening if you guys go with the current numbers.
      I strongly disagree, since its easier to make a duo for 2x2 theres a lot of people who doesnt even know what they are doing, when in a x5 you need a team who knows how to play the game and a single. Since its easier to make mistakes in a x5 a team who wins more matches its really a good team, in a x2 if u win a lot maybe u just got lucky and got matched agaisnt a bunch of people who doesn't even know how to play the game.

    • ySLiink wrote:

      Vocandin wrote:

      Seldom wrote:

      I like the way you are thinking, and we are thinking in the same-ish direction.
      Always keep in mind that these numbers are there to be tested for now on the test server.

      Basically what we are taking into consideration is the difference in the difficulty of creating a 5v5 or a 10v10 team compared to a 2v2 team.
      As it is quite a bit harder to create a 5v5 team and even harder to create a 10v10 team the incentive must give an edge to 5v5 and 10v10.
      Additionally, the skillsets are also hard to compare between these different modes, but the general idea is that there is a higher skill cap the more players are involved.

      You are right that there are whole communities based around 2v2s and 5v5s but if 10v10 and 5v5s don't outshine 2v2, the vast majority will not even consider to use or try the other modes as it will be equally as beneficial to just play a 2v2 hellgate with my buddy.

      But yeah, I just want to emphasize that you make a very good point, and splitting the match pool is a great concern to us but if we will find that players correspond in certain ways we are very willing to adjust the numbers :)

      I hope that makes a few things clearer,
      Greetings,
      Dom

      wolfo70 wrote:

      Seldom wrote:

      ...
      Appreciate the reply!It is important to note that hell gate wise, 2v2's have always been the most competitive with the biggest community around it. The reason people are unhappy is because these communities have been waiting for years to have an official ranking system to rank their skill and expertise. From our perspective, 2v2's are no different to corrupted dungeons with the only difference being a ranking system.
      In fact I would probably argue a 10v10 hellgate group requiring less skill then 2v2 or 5v5 (besides of course getting 10 people together).
      This is due to the comps and tactics that will probably be used in 10v10 making it quite simple.

      Also I would argue the less people a content needs the higher the bar of entry and skill gap exists.
      Example :
      • A higher barrier of entry : except if a experienced player is willing to mentor a newer player, its extremely difficult to improve or get on par with players who have been perfecting strategies for years. Mentoring newer players in 2v2 happens really rarely, almost no-one is willing to sacrifice weeks trying to guide a new player and also losing a lot of silver in the process. The opposite is true for 5v5. When I was still GM, we would make 5v5 groups each with 3 experienced players and 2 newer players, and this would work out quite effectively in teaching newer players, the 3 experienced players would be able to carry the other 2 a lot of the time teaching them in the process.

        I just feel the correlation between more players = more skill isn't entirely accurate.

      Wolfo really nails in on how HGs work in action rather than on paper, 2v2s are by far much more competitive, and I'd argue that individual skill matters much more the less players you have rather than the other way, adding more people just allows for more mistakes to be made most of the time as people make up for each other's mistakes.I really appreciate the response and I'm glad you can see our point on this matter. I hope in the end you guys make the right decision as I'd hate to see Hellgates, which were on the backburner for so long, get an update only for it to be a let down.

      New map layouts, requiring always a full party, chaining hellgates, hellgate map spawning. All these are amazing changes, you just really gotta get the IP cap and rewards balanced so everyone is happy, and unfortunately I can't see that happening if you guys go with the current numbers.
      I strongly disagree, since its easier to make a duo for 2x2 theres a lot of people who doesnt even know what they are doing, when in a x5 you need a team who knows how to play the game and a single. Since its easier to make mistakes in a x5 a team who wins more matches its really a good team, in a x2 if u win a lot maybe u just got lucky and got matched agaisnt a bunch of people who doesn't even know how to play the game.
      Point is that people in 2s do not want to get matched against people who don't know how to play the game.

      Also its easier to make mistakes in 5v5 yes, but a lot of the time its hard/impossible/irrelevant to capitalize on those mistakes, in fact there is a bunch of comps in 5s where you can literally smash your head against the keyboard and you will probably win. One of these comps for example is 3 melee's and 2 healers. Same exact thing will happen in 10s in fact I think those comps are going to be meta (7 melee's 3 healers).
      In 2v2's its for sure easier to capitalize on what maybe look like small and irrelevant mistakes from an outside perspective i.e. Recognizing that your opponent popped a holy blessing out of the correct rotation in 2v2 and instantly kill them for it. Example : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OIEA20wpWJ8&feature=youtu.be&ab_channel=Wolfo70

      Another thing i wanted to address is that 2v2,5v5,10v10 just isn't the same content, yes they are all called ''hellgates'' but that's about as far as the similarities go.
      At this point just call 2v2 hellgates 'Corrupted 2v2's' because they are 5 times more similar. :P

      The post was edited 1 time, last by wolfo70 ().

    • Seldom wrote:

      We are currently testing with an 80% cap in lethal 2v2 and 5v5.
      The idea is to get the balance just right, to get good fights and not make the entry-level too high for newer players.
      Below you find the current setup, but as always this is all something we will tinker with according to player feedback and the data that we can collect :)

      Ip requirement, caps, scaling, mob tier
      • Nonlethal
        • Hellgate 2v2 Nonlethal: 800ip requirement, 900ip cap, 90% scaling, T5 mobs
        • Hellgate 5v5 Nonlethal: 800ip requirement, 900ip cap, 90% scaling, T5 mobs
        • Hellgate 10v10 Nonlethal: 800ip requirement, 900ip cap, 90% scaling, T5 mobs
      • Lethal
        • Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 900ip requirement, 1100ip cap, 80% scaling, T6 mobs
        • Hellgate 5v5 lethal: 1000ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 80% scaling, T7 mobs
        • Hellgate 10v10 lethal: 1100ip requirement, 1300ip cap, 50% scaling, T8 mobs
      Hope this could help a bit,
      Friendly Greetings,
      Dom
      Thanks for taking the time to reply Dom. I wanted to address an issue that a bunch of people that I've talked to have. Rather than complain to other devs, I think you're probably the better person to talk to about it.

      In our eyes, while we understand there should be some "progression" from 2v2 -> 5v5 -> 10v10, aka we agree that you should get better rewards/fame for doing 10s over all of then. It's harder to get people together for them, and you want them to be rewarded. And we love the 50% scaling for 10v10, people should get rewarded for bringing better gear.
      We want to stress that both 2v2 and 5v5 should also have 50% scaling for the lethal variants. And if you don't agree with that, could you elaborate on why you feel that 80% is more fitting??

      The current 2v2 IP cap and scaling allows people to still bring lower tier gear and compete against those that bring flex gear, even with the 50% scaling WHILE also rewarding those that want to up tier their gear and flex their spec.


      What we propose is something along the lines of a minimum:

      Lethal
      • Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 900ip requirement, 1100ip cap, 50% 80% scaling, T6 mobs
      • Hellgate 5v5 lethal: 1000ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 50% 80% scaling, T7 mobs
      • Hellgate 10v10 lethal: 1100ip requirement, 1300ip cap, 50% scaling, T8 mobs

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Doomchinchilla ().

    • Lethal
      • Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 900ip requirement, 1100ip cap, 80% scaling, T6 mobs
      • Hellgate 5v5 lethal: 1000ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 80% scaling, T7 mobs
      • Hellgate 10v10 lethal: 1100ip requirement, 1300ip cap, 50% scaling, T8 mobs

        Thats the MOST RETARDED SHIT I ever seen in albion in recent changes.

        Stop trying to help the fucking newbs in every aspect of the game. You are doing a retarded move. You LITERALLY asked all the best 5v5 players in thsi game about their feedback and everyone said same stuff.

        Why you reward the FUCKIGN NEWBS that are supposed to be in a fuckign dungeon to farm? Or in the Non-lethal HG. Those retardeds that have no IQ or skill to play the game will lsoe anyway. DOESNT MATTER is its in 4.1 or 8.0. They are just bad and you doing that shit wont help them to get good. Let us have a fucking good content using our fucking good gears, instead of that shit that will reward only the FUCKING NEWBS.

        Gj removing all good players from the content they were looking for. I hope your decision to keep helping the fucking newbs kill that game. Because thats what albion deserve right now.

        Ty.



    • 2v2s have always been a popular and rewarding part of Albion, recently less-so because of the tome reduction and the addition of corrupted dungeons however they still remain a sought-after piece of content with a good source of silver and fame for skilled players. To be frank the proposed changes will kill the skilled 2v2 community and therefore a big part of why many people play Albion, by lowering the advantage that bringing higher IP gear gives people will ONLY bring inexpensive gear further decreasing the silver per hour for doing these to the point where I don't see any way skilled players will want to play them.

      Like Doomchinchilla said (go read his comment he explains further) this is a much better way to handle things:
      • Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 900ip requirement, 1100ip cap, 50% 80% scaling, T6 mobs
      • Hellgate 5v5 lethal: 1000ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 50% 80% scaling, T7 mobs
      • Hellgate 10v10 lethal: 1100ip requirement, 1300ip cap, 50% scaling, T8 mobs
      BUT I agree with Wolfo in that 2v2s are basically 2 man corrupted dungeons/corrupted dungeons are 1 man hell-gates and should have a hunter/stalker/slayer setting when clicking on the gate, preferably something like this:
      • (Hunter) Hellgate 2v2 non-lethal: 900ip requirement, 1100ip cap, 80% scaling, T5 mobs
      • (Stalker) Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 1100ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 50% scaling, T6 mobs
      • (Slayer) Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 1200ip requirement, 1300ip cap, 50% scaling, T7 mobs
      As for chest loot I hope that at higher infamy the rewards are better than the current ones on the live server many of us have invested hundreds and even thousands of hours mastering 2s higher infamy should reward players with way better loot, the better the loot the better the competition the longer the content stays alive and healthy.

      2v2s are often the starting point for players wanting to pvp because they want to play with their friends where as in corrupted dungeons you can't, and in my opinion this is why 2s are super important to keep in a healthy state.

    • Doomchinchilla wrote:

      Seldom wrote:

      We are currently testing with an 80% cap in lethal 2v2 and 5v5.
      The idea is to get the balance just right, to get good fights and not make the entry-level too high for newer players.
      Below you find the current setup, but as always this is all something we will tinker with according to player feedback and the data that we can collect :)

      Ip requirement, caps, scaling, mob tier
      • Nonlethal
        • Hellgate 2v2 Nonlethal: 800ip requirement, 900ip cap, 90% scaling, T5 mobs
        • Hellgate 5v5 Nonlethal: 800ip requirement, 900ip cap, 90% scaling, T5 mobs
        • Hellgate 10v10 Nonlethal: 800ip requirement, 900ip cap, 90% scaling, T5 mobs
      • Lethal
        • Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 900ip requirement, 1100ip cap, 80% scaling, T6 mobs
        • Hellgate 5v5 lethal: 1000ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 80% scaling, T7 mobs
        • Hellgate 10v10 lethal: 1100ip requirement, 1300ip cap, 50% scaling, T8 mobs
      Hope this could help a bit,
      Friendly Greetings,
      Dom
      Thanks for taking the time to reply Dom. I wanted to address an issue that a bunch of people that I've talked to have. Rather than complain to other devs, I think you're probably the better person to talk to about it.
      In our eyes, while we understand there should be some "progression" from 2v2 -> 5v5 -> 10v10, aka we agree that you should get better rewards/fame for doing 10s over all of then. It's harder to get people together for them, and you want them to be rewarded. And we love the 50% scaling for 10v10, people should get rewarded for bringing better gear.
      We want to stress that both 2v2 and 5v5 should also have 50% scaling for the lethal variants. And if you don't agree with that, could you elaborate on why you feel that 80% is more fitting??

      The current 2v2 IP cap and scaling allows people to still bring lower tier gear and compete against those that bring flex gear, even with the 50% scaling WHILE also rewarding those that want to up tier their gear and flex their spec.


      What we propose is something along the lines of a minimum:

      Lethal
      • Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 900ip requirement, 1100ip cap, 50% 80% scaling, T6 mobs
      • Hellgate 5v5 lethal: 1000ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 50% 80% scaling, T7 mobs
      • Hellgate 10v10 lethal: 1100ip requirement, 1300ip cap, 50% scaling, T8 mobs

      qube wrote:

      2v2s have always been a popular and rewarding part of Albion, recently less-so because of the tome reduction and the addition of corrupted dungeons however they still remain a sought-after piece of content with a good source of silver and fame for skilled players. To be frank the proposed changes will kill the skilled 2v2 community and therefore a big part of why many people play Albion, by lowering the advantage that bringing higher IP gear gives people will ONLY bring inexpensive gear further decreasing the silver per hour for doing these to the point where I don't see any way skilled players will want to play them.

      Like Doomchinchilla said (go read his comment he explains further) this is a much better way to handle things:
      • Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 900ip requirement, 1100ip cap, 50% 80% scaling, T6 mobs
      • Hellgate 5v5 lethal: 1000ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 50% 80% scaling, T7 mobs
      • Hellgate 10v10 lethal: 1100ip requirement, 1300ip cap, 50% scaling, T8 mobs
      BUT I agree with Wolfo in that 2v2s are basically 2 man corrupted dungeons/corrupted dungeons are 1 man hell-gates and should have a hunter/stalker/slayer setting when clicking on the gate, preferably something like this:
      • (Hunter) Hellgate 2v2 non-lethal: 900ip requirement, 1100ip cap, 80% scaling, T5 mobs
      • (Stalker) Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 1100ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 50% scaling, T6 mobs
      • (Slayer) Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 1200ip requirement, 1300ip cap, 50% scaling, T7 mobs
      As for chest loot I hope that at higher infamy the rewards are better than the current ones on the live server many of us have invested hundreds and even thousands of hours mastering 2s higher infamy should reward players with way better loot, the better the loot the better the competition the longer the content stays alive and healthy.

      2v2s are often the starting point for players wanting to pvp because they want to play with their friends where as in corrupted dungeons you can't, and in my opinion this is why 2s are super important to keep in a healthy state.
      Please listen to these comments.. 80% cap is too much... fighting in 4.1 is not going to interest people.

    • qube wrote:

      2v2s have always been a popular and rewarding part of Albion, recently less-so because of the tome reduction and the addition of corrupted dungeons however they still remain a sought-after piece of content with a good source of silver and fame for skilled players. To be frank the proposed changes will kill the skilled 2v2 community and therefore a big part of why many people play Albion, by lowering the advantage that bringing higher IP gear gives people will ONLY bring inexpensive gear further decreasing the silver per hour for doing these to the point where I don't see any way skilled players will want to play them.

      Like Doomchinchilla said (go read his comment he explains further) this is a much better way to handle things:
      • Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 900ip requirement, 1100ip cap, 50% 80% scaling, T6 mobs
      • Hellgate 5v5 lethal: 1000ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 50% 80% scaling, T7 mobs
      • Hellgate 10v10 lethal: 1100ip requirement, 1300ip cap, 50% scaling, T8 mobs
      BUT I agree with Wolfo in that 2v2s are basically 2 man corrupted dungeons/corrupted dungeons are 1 man hell-gates and should have a hunter/stalker/slayer setting when clicking on the gate, preferably something like this:
      • (Hunter) Hellgate 2v2 non-lethal: 900ip requirement, 1100ip cap, 80% scaling, T5 mobs
      • (Stalker) Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 1100ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 50% scaling, T6 mobs
      • (Slayer) Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 1200ip requirement, 1300ip cap, 50% scaling, T7 mobs
      As for chest loot I hope that at higher infamy the rewards are better than the current ones on the live server many of us have invested hundreds and even thousands of hours mastering 2s higher infamy should reward players with way better loot, the better the loot the better the competition the longer the content stays alive and healthy.

      2v2s are often the starting point for players wanting to pvp because they want to play with their friends where as in corrupted dungeons you can't, and in my opinion this is why 2s are super important to keep in a healthy state.
      Well said. Fully agree!

    • I agree with some parts. Just the part that says that we need 3 levels like Hunter - Stalker - Slayer, i complete disagree, because if you do 3 levels on hellgates, will divide players a lot, only 2 levels needed, because theres not that much players, and if the devs do that, the real experienced players, are not much, so we would stay a lot of time without finding anyone on the hellgates, thats my opinion.

      that would be perfect:

      • (Stalker) Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 900 ip requirement, 1000 ip cap, 20% scaling, T6 mobs
      • (Slayer) Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 1000ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 50% scaling, T8 mobs

    • @Seldom make the hellgate's cap become 50% like mentioned above.
      • Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 900ip requirement, 1100ip cap, 50% 80% scaling, T6 mobs
      • Hellgate 5v5 lethal: 1000ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 50% 80% scaling, T7 mobs
      • Hellgate 10v10 lethal: 1100ip requirement, 1300ip cap, 50% scaling, T8 mobs
      Please no one wants to fight people in 6.0 gear forever, we already do that in 5v5/20v20 Crystals EVERY SINGLE DAY besides Saturday which is the most exciting day for everyone, give us something new with this new infamy rework!

      The community is hyped with the infamy rework and everyone was expecting the item cap similar to how Corrupted Dungeons is, the 50% is important because it is FINALLY a reason to risk bringing something above 6.1 gear. Fights are way more exciting when fighting better players in higher tier, that's the coolest thing in a full loot pvp game.

      New players won't struggle because of a 50% cap, it's not like bringing 1 or 2 tiers above is any insane advantage with 50% cap, let the infamy system balance it by making noobs fight noobs and also there's non lethal dungeons for a reason

      The post was edited 1 time, last by EricWer ().

    • It seems that many people here weren't around during the time when GvG's didn't have an 80% soft-cap and were literally played by the same old elitist group over and over again. The saddest thing is that most of the comments are from those vets. If we want a content that many people play regularly the 80% soft-cap is ideal for not abusing the newcomers with T8.3 gentlemen. Stop navel-gazing.

    • Norgannon wrote:

      It seems that many people here weren't around during the time when GvG's didn't have an 80% soft-cap and were literally played by the same old elitist group over and over again. The saddest thing is that most of the comments are from those vets. If we want a content that many people play regularly the 80% soft-cap is ideal for not abusing the newcomers with T8.3 gentlemen. Stop navel-gazing.
      First off. We want a balance between newcomers and experienced players, thats why we're suggesting a Stalker and Slayer level like Corrupted dungeons.

      Second. Stop your pathetic attempt at straw manning, no one ever said no soft cap, we want a 50% softcap instead of 80% so that the gates aren't 6.0 tier all day. If this happens hellgates simply wont interesting to anyone. Meaning they implemented a infamy system for nothing because no one is competitive.

      Why even have a infamy system at that point when there isn't going to be any competitiveness.

    • EricWer wrote:

      @Seldom make the hellgate's cap become 50% like mentioned above.
      • Hellgate 2v2 lethal: 900ip requirement, 1100ip cap, 50% 80% scaling, T6 mobs
      • Hellgate 5v5 lethal: 1000ip requirement, 1200ip cap, 50% 80% scaling, T7 mobs
      • Hellgate 10v10 lethal: 1100ip requirement, 1300ip cap, 50% scaling, T8 mobs
      Please no one wants to fight people in 6.0 gear forever, we already do that in 5v5/20v20 Crystals EVERY SINGLE DAY besides Saturday which is the most exciting day for everyone, give us something new with this new infamy rework!

      The community is hyped with the infamy rework and everyone was expecting the item cap similar to how Corrupted Dungeons is, the 50% is important because it is FINALLY a reason to risk bringing something above 6.1 gear. Fights are way more exciting when fighting better players in higher tier, that's the coolest thing in a full loot pvp game.

      New players won't struggle because of a 50% cap, it's not like bringing 1 or 2 tiers above is any insane advantage with 50% cap, let the infamy system balance it by making noobs fight noobs and also there's non lethal dungeons for a reason
      ^ This really nails it.


      Norgannon wrote:

      It seems that many people here weren't around during the time when GvG's didn't have an 80% soft-cap and were literally played by the same old elitist group over and over again. The saddest thing is that most of the comments are from those vets. If we want a content that many people play regularly the 80% soft-cap is ideal for not abusing the newcomers with T8.3 gentlemen. Stop navel-gazing
      You fail to realize that new players got non-lethal, and they can still go in 6.1 or 8 flat overcharged depending on HG type and stand a very good chance against teams in better gear. 50% IP cap means there's at least something at stake for both teams. Look at slayer corrupteds right now, there is people in 8.3 but there's still loads in quite high infamy not in 8.3, if that's not balanced idk what is.

    • Norgannon wrote:

      It seems that many people here weren't around during the time when GvG's didn't have an 80% soft-cap and were literally played by the same old elitist group over and over again. The saddest thing is that most of the comments are from those vets. If we want a content that many people play regularly the 80% soft-cap is ideal for not abusing the newcomers with T8.3 gentlemen. Stop navel-gazing.
      Are you talking about way back when there was no Crystal GvGs and everything was uncapped/capped at 50% and 80% (mercia/cumbria/anglia)?
      The problem wasn’t ip cap, it was a “MATCHMAKING” PROBLEM. It didn’t matter what part of the blackzone I launched a GvG, the best teams would show up in every single GvG and dominate any new team. It was never an item power issue as all new teams got stomped no matter what gear tier.

      Infamy system is there to fix the hellgates and it already works in 1v1s. The 50% cap just makes it way more interesting.