Delete one hand dagger

    • Delete one hand dagger

      Simply that, delete or change the ability of the one-handed dagger, is not at all in accordance with the role of "assassin" a pure dps with as much mobility as that. He broke the 1vs1 3 moths ago but still breaking the hgs 2vs2. I don't understand how after almost a year it is still so profitable to play one-handed dagger + tank with staff. The anti-game that that build supposes makes no sense, it tries to kill you, it does not succeed and runs, it tries to kill you, it does not succeed and it runs and so on forever. I just died in hellgate duo after more than 15 attempts on his part, and so every day, boring fights. If I or my partner make a single mistake, it's over for us, they can make infinite mistakes, they have no consequences unless they are so bad that they make a very big mistake, which then if he dies, but even killing the dagger, the tank only has to take the loot of its dead companion and run infinitely. It is time to correct the slip that was made when such damage was given to the one-handed dagger, it makes no sense that that ability is magic damage, when there are very few magic damage resistances that are viable in 2v2. And above all, more than half of the players who play that compositional garbage are toxic, and you have to put up with the nonsense they are saying. I hope those kids get nerfed soon.
    • The comp 1hDagger+Quarterstaff in 2sHg is broken from more time than I want to remember and they dont fix the massive amount of controls
      and ability to reset the fight of the quarterstaff.



      When you play quarterstaff+dagger, you dont even need to inspect your opponent since your rotation is basically the same no matter what.

      The post was edited 3 times, last by JRoss ().

    • Dagger has already been nerfed big time and is countered by a handful of other meta builds out there.

      Like do you need to win every time and daggers to fail even when they outplay you for you to feel like it's balanced? Dagger is a 6-second burst. There are so many counters to punish a dagger which already punishes itself if it fails to get a lot out of their E.

      Give it a break... you must not be making any effort to outplay it.

      JRoss wrote:

      The comp 1hDagger+Quarterstaff in 2sHg is broken from more time than I want to remember and they dont fix the massive amount of controls
      and ability to reset the fight of the quarterstaff.
      When you play quarterstaff+dagger, you dont even need to inspect your opponent since your rotation is basically the same no matter what.

      [/quote]You do because if they have Graveguard boots gg

      The post was edited 2 times, last by MxKHD ().

    • Chispi wrote:

      Simply that, delete or change the ability of the one-handed dagger, is not at all in accordance with the role of "assassin" a pure dps with as much mobility as that. He broke the 1vs1 3 moths ago but still breaking the hgs 2vs2. I don't understand how after almost a year it is still so profitable to play one-handed dagger + tank with staff. The anti-game that that build supposes makes no sense, it tries to kill you, it does not succeed and runs, it tries to kill you, it does not succeed and it runs and so on forever. I just died in hellgate duo after more than 15 attempts on his part, and so every day, boring fights. If I or my partner make a single mistake, it's over for us, they can make infinite mistakes, they have no consequences unless they are so bad that they make a very big mistake, which then if he dies, but even killing the dagger, the tank only has to take the loot of its dead companion and run infinitely. It is time to correct the slip that was made when such damage was given to the one-handed dagger, it makes no sense that that ability is magic damage, when there are very few magic damage resistances that are viable in 2v2. And above all, more than half of the players who play that compositional garbage are toxic, and you have to put up with the nonsense they are saying. I hope those kids get nerfed soon.
      one handed dagger + quarterstaff is broken more because of the staff than the dagger. Quarterstaff E is gonna be rework soon, which will break this combo.

      The upcoming lava mechanic can also remove the option to run indefinitely.

      Also, you can kill a quarterstaff running solo even in the current 2v2 HG. If you can't kill a quarterstaff running by himself inside the HG, it's because he's more experienced than you 2. It's not a balance problem.
      Solo/duo player.
      Play mostly tank
      Max spec 700/700 in staff, hammer, mace, and spear tree.
      Max spec 800/800 in all head, chest, shoes pieces.
      Max spec potions crafters.
    • pinto wrote:

      the problem is the knight armor that the quarterstaff uses.
      if they made it a channeling spell, comps as 1h dagger + quarterstaff wouldn't be a problem, as they couldn't reset the fight infinitely.
      The problem is definitely not the wind wall. If you change the wind wall to channeling, it's just break the item without changing this situation.

      When the reason I run knight armor with quarter staff (or any other CC) is because the wind wall is used to separate the healer from the dps against healer&dps pair. Quarterstaff doesn't need wind wall to reset. You only need cartwheel. Cartwheel is extremely fast when you are being chase. If you keep proc the speed on every cartwheel, not a single thing can catch you with a staff.
      Solo/duo player.
      Play mostly tank
      Max spec 700/700 in staff, hammer, mace, and spear tree.
      Max spec 800/800 in all head, chest, shoes pieces.
      Max spec potions crafters.
    • deenne wrote:

      SpicyPepper wrote:

      Quarterstaff doesn't need wind wall to reset.
      but your teammate need it after faild 1 shot combo. :) it giving you infinity tries.

      pinto wrote:

      quarterstaff wouldn't be a problem, as they couldn't reset the fight infinitely.
      yup. failed combo = dead.. QS or DPS choose;]
      bump, make a WW channeled spell.
      No my teammate doesn't need it after the failed combo, especially in dagger case. Having the WW is a plus when you run out, but not a must. CC dps run wind wall to separate healer from dps, not to run out. There're a bunch of shit that enable one to go through WW, if you rely on it as your main mean of escaping running CC DPS then you're pretty much fucked up.

      More often than not, you don't have the WW while retreating back out because you've already used it to attempt to separate the healer from the dps during the combo. Despite that, you reset fight anyway.

      Pairing with a slow moving dps (like shadowcaller, spirit hunter, badon, blazing staff). the DPS run first while the CC stay behind to block with various CC for a while then run by himself. It works because of cartwheel and slowing charge (but tomb hammer doesn't work anymore after the nerf), not wind wall. You can kill these pair running curse + healer. Will need a few rotation but curse can kill the CC that stay behind if he make mistake.

      Pairing with a fast moving dps (like permafrost or dagger). They both run with both incredible speed and CC. Specifically in dagger case, they have head and cape slot open for knight helm+ sterling cape (perma is pretty much stuck with Morgana cape + royal cowl). Curse still have it chance against these, but a bit harder to kill. And you kill the CC first, not the dps.


      You can only break QS + dagger by:
      1. nerfing single target CC on QS (which is coming with the E rework)
      2. nerfing mobility on cartwheel when escaping (this might hurt gatherers as a lot of them rely on this mobility to escaped being swarmed by large ganking pt)
      3. Up coming lava mechanic also prevent people from running forever, so if you run healer dps, you'll only need to survive some attempt to burst you before the lava come up.
      "failed combo = dead" is an unfair balance for CC DPS. healer dps fight with sustain + brawl capability. CC dps fight with CC and mobility. You bring healer there wanting people who is faster, but weaker in a face to face brawl, sitting still to fight you then cry about their mobility, is exactly the same as bringing Guardian Boot then cry about people using regular run to reset fight.

      "It's unfair he can reset fight indefinitely, can't kill builds with regular run. Let's nerf regular run because i want to use my giant boots"

      The upcoming lava mechanic is a very good way to balance this. I'd say 3-5 failed combo = dead is a more appropriate balance, but that's up to a future debate.
      Solo/duo player.
      Play mostly tank
      Max spec 700/700 in staff, hammer, mace, and spear tree.
      Max spec 800/800 in all head, chest, shoes pieces.
      Max spec potions crafters.

      The post was edited 4 times, last by SpicyPepper ().

    • pinto wrote:

      the problem is the knight armor that the quarterstaff uses.
      if they made it a channeling spell, comps as 1h dagger + quarterstaff wouldn't be a problem, as they couldn't reset the fight infinitely.
      Sorry to tell you that without WW they still reset fight indefinitely. It just make it much harder to burst healer + dps combo because it'll be even much harder than it is right now to separate the healer from the dps.


      MxKHD wrote:


      You do because if they have Graveguard boots gg
      Who the heck bring use Graveguard boots anymore ?? My grandma runs faster than that boots now. and GG what?? You just need more rotation to kill someone dumb enough to use grave guard boot. Just keep repeating the combo until they mess the boot and die. How can grave boot chase anything in the game ?? Just take more time to kill.
      Solo/duo player.
      Play mostly tank
      Max spec 700/700 in staff, hammer, mace, and spear tree.
      Max spec 800/800 in all head, chest, shoes pieces.
      Max spec potions crafters.
    • SpicyPepper wrote:

      pinto wrote:

      the problem is the knight armor that the quarterstaff uses.
      if they made it a channeling spell, comps as 1h dagger + quarterstaff wouldn't be a problem, as they couldn't reset the fight infinitely.
      Sorry to tell you that without WW they still reset fight indefinitely. It just make it much harder to burst healer + dps combo because it'll be even much harder than it is right now to separate the healer from the dps.

      MxKHD wrote:

      You do because if they have Graveguard boots gg
      Who the heck bring use Graveguard boots anymore ?? My grandma runs faster than that boots now. and GG what?? You just need more rotation to kill someone dumb enough to use grave guard boot. Just keep repeating the combo until they mess the boot and die. How can grave boot chase anything in the game ?? Just take more time to kill.
      quaterstaves need knight armor to reset indefinitely, without it they couldn't reset the fight against weapons as claymore that has a great mobility to chase quatterstaves.
      knight armor is also a problem in CDG, so they could make it a channeling spell(or rework the chest entirely) and make it work only in zergs.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by pinto ().

    • SpicyPepper wrote:

      deenne wrote:

      SpicyPepper wrote:

      Quarterstaff doesn't need wind wall to reset.
      but your teammate need it after faild 1 shot combo. :) it giving you infinity tries.

      pinto wrote:

      quarterstaff wouldn't be a problem, as they couldn't reset the fight infinitely.
      yup. failed combo = dead.. QS or DPS choose;]bump, make a WW channeled spell.
      No my teammate doesn't need it after the failed combo, especially in dagger case. Having the WW is a plus when you run out, but not a must. CC dps run wind wall to separate healer from dps, not to run out. There're a bunch of shit that enable one to go through WW, if you rely on it as your main mean of escaping running CC DPS then you're pretty much fucked up.
      More often than not, you don't have the WW while retreating back out because you've already used it to attempt to separate the healer from the dps during the combo. Despite that, you reset fight anyway.

      Pairing with a slow moving dps (like shadowcaller, spirit hunter, badon, blazing staff). the DPS run first while the CC stay behind to block with various CC for a while then run by himself. It works because of cartwheel and slowing charge (but tomb hammer doesn't work anymore after the nerf), not wind wall. You can kill these pair running curse + healer. Will need a few rotation but curse can kill the CC that stay behind if he make mistake.

      Pairing with a fast moving dps (like permafrost or dagger). They both run with both incredible speed and CC. Specifically in dagger case, they have head and cape slot open for knight helm+ sterling cape (perma is pretty much stuck with Morgana cape + royal cowl). Curse still have it chance against these, but a bit harder to kill. And you kill the CC first, not the dps.


      You can only break QS + dagger by:
      1. nerfing single target CC on QS (which is coming with the E rework)
      2. nerfing mobility on cartwheel when escaping (this might hurt gatherers as a lot of them rely on this mobility to escaped being swarmed by large ganking pt)
      3. Up coming lava mechanic also prevent people from running forever, so if you run healer dps, you'll only need to survive some attempt to burst you before the lava come up.
      "failed combo = dead" is an unfair balance for CC DPS. healer dps fight with sustain + brawl capability. CC dps fight with CC and mobility. You bring healer there wanting people who is faster, but weaker in a face to face brawl, sitting still to fight you then cry about their mobility, is exactly the same as bringing Guardian Boot then cry about people using regular run to reset fight.

      "It's unfair he can reset fight indefinitely, can't kill builds with regular run. Let's nerf regular run because i want to use my giant boots"

      The upcoming lava mechanic is a very good way to balance this. I'd say 3-5 failed combo = dead is a more appropriate balance, but that's up to a future debate.

      no one will read this shit.. after QS nerf theres ava staff, same shit. rework not cuz its broken, rework cuz of 2 same ability.
      give me video how u play QS without WW and u dont die after faild combo LUL.
      I dont get it some clowns make post for 3000 words.. when everyones knows the wind wall is for reset fight infinity.
    • deenne wrote:

      SpicyPepper wrote:

      deenne wrote:

      SpicyPepper wrote:

      Quarterstaff doesn't need wind wall to reset.
      but your teammate need it after faild 1 shot combo. :) it giving you infinity tries.

      pinto wrote:

      quarterstaff wouldn't be a problem, as they couldn't reset the fight infinitely.
      yup. failed combo = dead.. QS or DPS choose;]bump, make a WW channeled spell.
      No my teammate doesn't need it after the failed combo, especially in dagger case. Having the WW is a plus when you run out, but not a must. CC dps run wind wall to separate healer from dps, not to run out. There're a bunch of shit that enable one to go through WW, if you rely on it as your main mean of escaping running CC DPS then you're pretty much fucked up.More often than not, you don't have the WW while retreating back out because you've already used it to attempt to separate the healer from the dps during the combo. Despite that, you reset fight anyway.

      Pairing with a slow moving dps (like shadowcaller, spirit hunter, badon, blazing staff). the DPS run first while the CC stay behind to block with various CC for a while then run by himself. It works because of cartwheel and slowing charge (but tomb hammer doesn't work anymore after the nerf), not wind wall. You can kill these pair running curse + healer. Will need a few rotation but curse can kill the CC that stay behind if he make mistake.

      Pairing with a fast moving dps (like permafrost or dagger). They both run with both incredible speed and CC. Specifically in dagger case, they have head and cape slot open for knight helm+ sterling cape (perma is pretty much stuck with Morgana cape + royal cowl). Curse still have it chance against these, but a bit harder to kill. And you kill the CC first, not the dps.


      You can only break QS + dagger by:
      1. nerfing single target CC on QS (which is coming with the E rework)
      2. nerfing mobility on cartwheel when escaping (this might hurt gatherers as a lot of them rely on this mobility to escaped being swarmed by large ganking pt)
      3. Up coming lava mechanic also prevent people from running forever, so if you run healer dps, you'll only need to survive some attempt to burst you before the lava come up.
      "failed combo = dead" is an unfair balance for CC DPS. healer dps fight with sustain + brawl capability. CC dps fight with CC and mobility. You bring healer there wanting people who is faster, but weaker in a face to face brawl, sitting still to fight you then cry about their mobility, is exactly the same as bringing Guardian Boot then cry about people using regular run to reset fight.

      "It's unfair he can reset fight indefinitely, can't kill builds with regular run. Let's nerf regular run because i want to use my giant boots"

      The upcoming lava mechanic is a very good way to balance this. I'd say 3-5 failed combo = dead is a more appropriate balance, but that's up to a future debate.
      no one will read this shit.. after QS nerf theres ava staff, same shit. rework not cuz its broken, rework cuz of 2 same ability.
      give me video how u play QS without WW and u dont die after faild combo LUL, .
      I dont get it some clowns make post for 3000 words.. when everyones knows the wind wall is for reset fight infinity.
      he's 700/700 in STUN weapons(mace, qs, hammer), so i can understand why he's trying to convince people that windwall isn't a problem.
      if SBI nerf regular quatterstaff but let windwall as it's now he can keep playing with retarded cheese builds.
    • deenne wrote:

      no one will read this shit.. after QS nerf theres ava staff, same shit. rework not cuz its broken, rework cuz of 2 same ability.
      give me video how u play QS without WW and u dont die after faild combo LUL, clown.
      I dont get it some clowns make post for 3000 words.. when everyones knows the wind wall is for reset fight infinity.

      You 2 watch this, and this ,and this, and this. This is how Wind Wall is used in HG, not to "run". Accept for those running HG casually, everyone else and their mothers run purity robes in HG. the Wall doesn't save you.

      Watch stream of anyone playing CC DPS decently, you'll see ALL of them using Wind Wall like that.

      If you think ava staff E is the same as QS then you definitely don't know a thing about those staves =)). Good luck killing anyone decent in HG with ava staff, against healer dps, that staff is garbage running as a CC. Might work out running as double dps, pairing with a black hands but there are way better options for that.


      pinto wrote:

      if SBI nerf regular quatterstaff but let windwall as it's now he can keep playing with retarded cheese builds.
      There were only 2 CC options in HG, tomb hammer or quarterstaff. Tomb hammer is out of the picture after the nerf. After QS staff E rework. There won't be CC DPS comb in HG.

      If Wind Wall is a channel spell, I can still pull that same shit in the vids, it doesn't change anything because when I already used wind wall, I've already finished my role, it's up to the dps after that to kill the other dps. I don't need to do anything else so I'm free to channel it. If it's a fail attempt. We get out with CC and move speed like we always do. The difference is that there will be lava coming up in the upcoming patch, so we don't have infinite attempt anymore.


      I'd take a channeled Wind Wall any day, if they make the wall impassable even with displacement immunity. Deal ?
      Solo/duo player.
      Play mostly tank
      Max spec 700/700 in staff, hammer, mace, and spear tree.
      Max spec 800/800 in all head, chest, shoes pieces.
      Max spec potions crafters.

      The post was edited 2 times, last by SpicyPepper ().

    • SpicyPepper wrote:

      You 2 watch this, and this, and this. This is how Wind Wall is used in HG, not to "run". Accept for those running HG casually, everyone else and their mothers run purity robes in HG. the Wall doesn't save you.

      Watch stream of anyone playing CC DPS decently, you'll see ALL of them using Wind Wall like that.

      If you think ava staff E is the same as QS then you definitely don't know a thing about those staves =)). Good luck killing anyone decent in HG with ava staff, against healer dps, that staff is garbage running as a CC. Might work out running as double dps, pairing with a black hands but there are way better options for that.
      sometimes I have the impression that conversations on this forum are harder than talking to a monkey .. and what does this have to do with what the conversation is about? after all, if WW was channeled, you can use it in the same way, but you can't use it to reset combat ..

      you showed about 3 fights with noobs, I checked who you fought, and most of them do not exceed 200m pvp .. and you write something about serious PVP players, the second thing is the movies from January before nerf, tombhammer .. every "pitcher" was able to 1 shoot with a tomb hammer. I'm not judging .. do and play what you want but WW should be channeled. THE END.
    • deenne wrote:

      sometimes I have the impression that conversations on this forum are harder than talking to a monkey .. and what does this have to do with what the conversation is about? after all, if WW was channeled, you can use it in the same way, but you can't use it to reset combat ..
      you showed about 3 fights with noobs, I checked who you fought, and most of them do not exceed 200m pvp .. and you write something about serious PVP players, the second thing is the movies from January before nerf, tombhammer .. every "pitcher" was able to 1 shoot with a tomb hammer. I'm not judging .. do and play what you want but WW should be channeled. THE END.
      I'm not a streamer, I don't record gameplay all day. If you asked for clip out of no where ofc they gonna be old. Also, give me a clip you nuke someone decent with tomb hammer without using wind wall to knock healer away.

      Also, I've just checked and that claymore dude in the second clip has 1.1 billion kill fame and you call him noob. Yeah, everyone else is noob except you.

      I can relate that conversation is harder than talking to a monkey when you said you don't know how this related to WW being used to run.

      I'm also not judging anything. It's indeed appropriate to end the discussion here. Different people have different opinion is all.
      Solo/duo player.
      Play mostly tank
      Max spec 700/700 in staff, hammer, mace, and spear tree.
      Max spec 800/800 in all head, chest, shoes pieces.
      Max spec potions crafters.
    • SpicyPepper wrote:

      Different people have different opinion is all.
      but you tell me that WW is only used to pushout heal .. and cannot be used otherwise than what you wrote .. it would really be more rational to talk to a monkey than to talk to you ..

      + you can see only yourself and your gameplay as good.. I want remind you in AO exist are too, CD,and people what abusing this item to do infinity resets, with different playstyle than yours.

      I'd take a channeled Wind Wall any day, if they make the wall impassable even with displacement immunity. Deal ?

      and this is what we ask for, you see how stupid you are, you excuse yourself and propose what we write about.

      SpicyPepper wrote:

      Also, give me a clip you nuke someone decent with tomb hammer without using wind wall to knock healer away.
      I hate and never play a 1 shot coop :) its not fun and I hate gameplay like this if u killing someone without any chance to fight back.

      SpicyPepper wrote:

      Yeah, everyone else is noob except you.
      I'm decent at my game, that's why I speak out and fight against "builds" like you are useing to one shot people without fighting. :)
    • Saccavirano wrote:

      SpicyPepper wrote:

      The upcoming lava mechanic is a very good way to balance this. I'd say 3-5 failed combo = dead is a more appropriate balance, but that's up to a future debate.
      I'm afraid that would be the time of bedrock mace and knight armor or something like that. Just push them to the lava and loot.
      excatly this will be clown fiesta, 10 knight armors, 10 ironclads,+"cloth" helmets and Gl HG.
    • Saccavirano wrote:

      SpicyPepper wrote:

      The upcoming lava mechanic is a very good way to balance this. I'd say 3-5 failed combo = dead is a more appropriate balance, but that's up to a future debate.
      I'm afraid that would be the time of bedrock mace and knight armor or something like that. Just push them to the lava and loot.
      Pretty sure lava is just the graphical effect. I think the lava will just make the map smaller. Like it'll delete part of the map. Like in the current HG, there're already been lava spot where you can't walk over. Hope that's the case.
      Solo/duo player.
      Play mostly tank
      Max spec 700/700 in staff, hammer, mace, and spear tree.
      Max spec 800/800 in all head, chest, shoes pieces.
      Max spec potions crafters.