Ranged weapons imbalanced in corrupted dungeons

    • Ranged weapons imbalanced in corrupted dungeons

      I would like to listen your opinions about this topic:
      As the tittle says, the actual gamplay in this kind of content is getting really absurd, almost every build is an unchaseable ranged build.
      -Playing melee has no sense since it's really underpowered in comparisson to ranged
      - Melee weapon passives are garbage compared to ranged passives, literally have no sense to keep them in this way
      -Bow got 2 slows (passive and W) and an interrupt Q which counters sorcerer boots
      - Literally every frost staff is unchaseable, btw, compare the frost staff Q with any melee Q, the power gap is awesome due to the slow
      -Xbows and curse staffs are so balanced that they don't need some kind of mobility since they are able to insta kill you even in 4.1 open world
      -There is no drawback using ranged weapon, since you got the distance advantage and every jacket / robe / plate works at it's 100% efectiveness in the same way as a melee weapon, plus the ranged weapon passives are op
      -Melee has extra risk due to it's melee nature, but literally 0 advantages that could be something like extra hp in every melee weapon, extra dmg, extra defenses (just examples). There are some weapons that give you hp, but there are better [ranged] options
      - The only real melee builds are the ones which only works in 8.3 sets (one shots). Other builds (black hands, pike, etc) are not in this kind of builds because they are EXTREMELY EASY to counter
      - The same said above can be applied to 2v2, 5v5, zvz, open world, etc
      - Melee buff when :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?:

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Lunaecanis ().

    • bro every melee weapon has a health buff on them at least 150 hp minimum

      even their basic attacks hit almost 1.5 times as hard as range ones

      and their over all base damage or cc is also notably higher most range counter parts

      if you put range weapons and melee weapons at point blank melees win most of the time

      the only reason why range has a huge advantage compared to melee is the inherent mobility they have in their kit and how players use it to kite melees through traps.

    • Lunaecanis wrote:

      I would like to listen your opinions about this topic:
      As the tittle says, the actual gamplay in this kind of content is getting really absurd, almost every build is an unchaseable ranged build.
      -Playing melee has no sense since it's really underpowered in comparisson to ranged
      - Melee weapon passives are garbage compared to ranged passives, literally have no sense to keep them in this way
      -Bow got 2 slows (passive and W) and an interrupt Q which counters sorcerer boots
      - Literally every frost staff is unchaseable, btw, compare the frost staff Q with any melee Q, the power gap is awesome due to the slow
      -Xbows and curse staffs are so balanced that they don't need some kind of mobility since they are able to insta kill you even in 4.1 open world
      -There is no drawback using ranged weapon, since you got the distance advantage and every jacket / robe / plate works at it's 100% efectiveness in the same way as a melee weapon, plus the ranged weapon passives are op
      -Melee has extra risk due to it's melee nature, but literally 0 advantages that could be something like extra hp in every melee weapon, extra dmg, extra defenses (just examples). There are some weapons that give you hp, but there are better [ranged] options
      - The only real melee builds are the ones which only works in 8.3 sets (one shots). Other builds (black hands, pike, etc) are not in this kind of builds because they are EXTREMELY EASY to counter
      - The same said above can be applied to 2v2, 5v5, zvz, open world, etc
      - Melee buff when :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?:
      Every melee weapon gives you extra health. Every melee weapon has either a +defense passive or +healing passive. Every melee weapon (but tank ones I think) has more base damage than ranged weapons. Melee has extremely high representation in all contents in the game. During LONG time after corrupted release Swords had extremely high representation, also Bloodletter. You have A LOT of good melee weapons for many situations, so I really don't understand what's the issue you're pointing out. Most passives on ranged weapons are CRAP btw, the only really good ones are the crossbow reset Q one, the cast speed ones and maybe the bow piercing one.

    • Hi gabumon it feels good to see a fellow active member on forums

      and i agree with you. besides the some outliners like one shots or quote unquote ZvZ weapons with Resilience penetration

      game is mostly balanced besides the occasional things like mistpiercer, hallowfall, realmbreaker, chillhowl. sandles of purity, robe of purity, plate armours

      uh... i take it back abit game is not as balanced for 1v1s as i thought but more around team play. oh well as long as another Hallowfall meta does not emerge i think the game would be fine until the next patch.

      i realy hope curse gets a rework like spears. cursed beam sucks alot

    • oh dont like kite builds? how about swords which has sustained highest mobility in the game. how about u do something about those one shot builds? most melees like blackhands pike claymore one shot? how about tombhammer? dont talk like being range is like super good. ranged weapons has generaly less base damage than melee so dont complain. combine this fact with the fact that melees do more damage in group fights and zvz cause of resilence pen that all range weapons dont have and there u have it the game is balanced around group pvp.

      take chillhowl for example they have heavy cc and play hit and run cause in a straight up fight against something like bow with same range they just lose in damage

      i agree that the game is not perfect when it comes to 1v1 balance so deal with it (outliners of this not so perfect is hallowfall and the recent tombhammer,1 handed dagger one combo) those are super broken atm

    • Compare kite + burst damage+ range damage to oneshot is stupid. One shot is almost dead at Open world, gvg and at cd lacks efficiency.
      Base damage means nothing without speed Attack and movement. Everyone would be playing spear having one of highest base damage but it's outdamage but less base damage like daggers.

      Chillhowl has already a trhead. Don't mix things.

      That's bullshit about melee great damage at ZvZ. Brimstone, avalonian bow , avalonian xbow are laughing hard at That shit.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by PaladinJavier ().

    • PaladinJavier wrote:

      Compare kite + burst damage+ range damage to oneshot is stupid. One shot is almost dead at Open world, gvg and at cd lacks efficiency.
      Base damage means nothing without speed Attack and movement. Everyone would be playing spear having one of highest base damage but it's outdamage but less base damage like daggers.

      Chillhowl has already a trhead. Don't mix things.

      That's bullshit about melee great damage at ZvZ. Brimstone, avalonian bow , avalonian xbow are laughing hard at That shit.
      Consistent damage and safety are factors to consider too. For example, a Sword in CD if on range will get you with their autos all the time, creating a lot of pressure while you wait for CDs. In ZvZ melees don't have the time to auto enough, but they have AoE low CD abilities that create a lot of pressure around them with a lot of consistency

    • Gabumon wrote:

      PaladinJavier wrote:

      Compare kite + burst damage+ range damage to oneshot is stupid. One shot is almost dead at Open world, gvg and at cd lacks efficiency.
      Base damage means nothing without speed Attack and movement. Everyone would be playing spear having one of highest base damage but it's outdamage but less base damage like daggers.

      Chillhowl has already a trhead. Don't mix things.

      That's bullshit about melee great damage at ZvZ. Brimstone, avalonian bow , avalonian xbow are laughing hard at That shit.
      Consistent damage and safety are factors to consider too. For example, a Sword in CD if on range will get you with their autos all the time, creating a lot of pressure while you wait for CDs. In ZvZ melees don't have the time to auto enough, but they have AoE low CD abilities that create a lot of pressure around them with a lot of consistency
      I think it's a tactical move to have pressure against burst dps cloth users. Axes and bleed DoT are Best at this but no way You can compare power of destruction of a Brimstone+Camlann Combo burst.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by PaladinJavier ().

    • PaladinJavier wrote:

      Tabor wrote:

      The only super broken ranged weapon against melee is bow. It has long range AND the ability of constant peel with multishot Q combined with jumpback W. Multishot could definitely use a nerf.
      I think That's to panic cloth users, usually using DoT like bleedings (axes are Best at this) so they use defensive and are vulnerable to Camlann's Vendetta + AOE damage combo or Bloodletters.
      Bleed doesn´t offer any advantage apart proccing your mercenary jacket, and that´s all.

      Bleed itself gives you HUGE disadvantages:
      1)Against thorns : the reflected damage hits me for more than my bleed, what a bullshit.
      2) It procs soldier armor
      3) Armor of valor reflects it - what a bullshit. My bleed hits for 5 damage and reflect damage hits me for many times more - what are these mechanics ?
      4) Guardian armor easily removes it
      5) it procs Cleric Robe.

      Bleed is not an advantage. Unlike curses, the bleed doesn´t hit that hard until you keep high stacks and generally, it just annoying. If you don´t play mercenary jacket, it gives you literally 0 advantages, while it gives plenty of advantages to enemies. And i can´t even turn off my bleed, so that´s frigging perfect.

      And yeah, bow is broken.

      Sprint on shoes, jump on W, knockback shot on Q - and yep. That´s too much. The new knockback Q shot is just way too much and it deserves some tweaking. Longer CD probably. Hell, i can imagine squad of bows acting like a windwall by using Q against people during ZvZ lol.


      Either way, currently, CD aren´t much fun. It consists of plate armors, stun plates ( tombhammer, polehammer or whatever its called), plateletters, frost with plates, heal with plates.
      Man this CD meta is really boring.
      Oh yeah, and 1H dagger with miner shoes - or boltcasters with miner shoes. Let´s not forget these two. They can try and try and if they will see they wont succeed, they just run with miner shoes and there is literallly Nothing you can do. So much fun.

      Edit : Tested bleed vs armor of valor.
      Bleed hits for 5 damage per second. Amor of valor ( 4.3) hits for 65 damage per tick. It also silences the axe guy. So armor of valor not only deals lot of damage to axe, it will silence him for about 6 seconds. This needs to be changed.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Borbarad ().

    • Borbarad wrote:

      PaladinJavier wrote:

      Tabor wrote:

      The only super broken ranged weapon against melee is bow. It has long range AND the ability of constant peel with multishot Q combined with jumpback W. Multishot could definitely use a nerf.
      I think That's to panic cloth users, usually using DoT like bleedings (axes are Best at this) so they use defensive and are vulnerable to Camlann's Vendetta + AOE damage combo or Bloodletters.
      Bleed doesn´t offer any advantage apart proccing your mercenary jacket, and that´s all.
      Bleed itself gives you HUGE disadvantages:
      1)Against thorns : the reflected damage hits me for more than my bleed, what a bullshit.
      2) It procs soldier armor
      3) Armor of valor reflects it - what a bullshit. My bleed hits for 5 damage and reflect damage hits me for many times more - what are these mechanics ?
      4) Guardian armor easily removes it
      5) it procs Cleric Robe.

      Bleed is not an advantage. Unlike curses, the bleed doesn´t hit that hard until you keep high stacks and generally, it just annoying. If you don´t play mercenary jacket, it gives you literally 0 advantages, while it gives plenty of advantages to enemies. And i can´t even turn off my bleed, so that´s frigging perfect.

      And yeah, bow is broken.

      Sprint on shoes, jump on W, knockback shot on Q - and yep. That´s too much. The new knockback Q shot is just way too much and it deserves some tweaking. Longer CD probably. Hell, i can imagine squad of bows acting like a windwall by using Q against people during ZvZ lol.


      Either way, currently, CD aren´t much fun. It consists of plate armors, stun plates ( tombhammer, polehammer or whatever its called), plateletters, frost with plates, heal with plates.
      Man this CD meta is really boring.
      Oh yeah, and 1H dagger with miner shoes - or boltcasters with miner shoes. Let´s not forget these two. They can try and try and if they will see they wont succeed, they just run with miner shoes and there is literallly Nothing you can do. So much fun.
      and here is guy who play CD not once or two per day but for more and he knows what he talk about.
      NERDS, useless comments before this god one.
      xmas time but how long we have to w8 for changes/balanse 3months ?

    • dont know about you but bow using frost shot to me feels like so wrong. i am more of the explosive arrow person where i stand and shoot

      die to purge though

      but i can see where in a 1v1 situation where frost shot with the knockback q makes it very hard for most melees to get close in 1v1 situations with bows like badon and warbow. cc on 2 skills makes it as bad as frost blink on chillhowl and 1h frost

      tried both play styles but frost shot is not my cup of tea

      i still have a 80% lose rate against black hands though even with frost shot playstyle as most one shot builds in corrupted aka the tombhammer, 1h dagger (royal helmet), 1h fire with keeper wrecks regular bow when i use merc jacket or sometimes cleric robe

      i have no problems against the hallowfall/chillhowl meta last patch cause i was running soldier boots and have tons of dps but one shot builds man.

      against claymore it is a 50/50 win lost chance cause of mage robe just screwing with me even though it is consider a one shot build also
      while against bolt caster and crossbows its also an even fight even when boltcasters are known for their one combo potential with double silence

    • Borbarad wrote:

      PaladinJavier wrote:

      Tabor wrote:

      The only super broken ranged weapon against melee is bow. It has long range AND the ability of constant peel with multishot Q combined with jumpback W. Multishot could definitely use a nerf.
      I think That's to panic cloth users, usually using DoT like bleedings (axes are Best at this) so they use defensive and are vulnerable to Camlann's Vendetta + AOE damage combo or Bloodletters.
      Bleed doesn´t offer any advantage apart proccing your mercenary jacket, and that´s all.
      Bleed itself gives you HUGE disadvantages:
      1)Against thorns : the reflected damage hits me for more than my bleed, what a bullshit.
      2) It procs soldier armor
      3) Armor of valor reflects it - what a bullshit. My bleed hits for 5 damage and reflect damage hits me for many times more - what are these mechanics ?
      4) Guardian armor easily removes it
      5) it procs Cleric Robe.

      Bleed is not an advantage. Unlike curses, the bleed doesn´t hit that hard until you keep high stacks and generally, it just annoying. If you don´t play mercenary jacket, it gives you literally 0 advantages, while it gives plenty of advantages to enemies. And i can´t even turn off my bleed, so that´s frigging perfect.

      And yeah, bow is broken.

      Sprint on shoes, jump on W, knockback shot on Q - and yep. That´s too much. The new knockback Q shot is just way too much and it deserves some tweaking. Longer CD probably. Hell, i can imagine squad of bows acting like a windwall by using Q against people during ZvZ lol.


      Either way, currently, CD aren´t much fun. It consists of plate armors, stun plates ( tombhammer, polehammer or whatever its called), plateletters, frost with plates, heal with plates.
      Man this CD meta is really boring.
      Oh yeah, and 1H dagger with miner shoes - or boltcasters with miner shoes. Let´s not forget these two. They can try and try and if they will see they wont succeed, they just run with miner shoes and there is literallly Nothing you can do. So much fun.

      Edit : Tested bleed vs armor of valor.
      Bleed hits for 5 damage per second. Amor of valor ( 4.3) hits for 65 damage per tick. It also silences the axe guy. So armor of valor not only deals lot of damage to axe, it will silence him for about 6 seconds. This needs to be changed.
      1) bow is a bit op-agree
      2)cd meta is cancer-agree
      3)bleeds are disadvantage for all axes aside merc users-agree
      4) bleed vs valor - disagree
      It should work like that, it works like cultist cowl
      If axe has advantages via free merc with that bleed (invulnerable to mage robe) - there should be another side - disadvantage vs such items like cultist and valor
      That’s means balancing the weapon

    • Mrpotato wrote:

      Melee has more damage and a lot mote health


      I use both fire and quarterstaff and the health gap between a T4 staff and a T4.2 is like 210, (quarterstaff has more)

      also most melee weapons have at least 1 mobility spell while most ranged dont have one (ice is an exception)
      cc/slow/knockback is the same like pure mobility in 1v1
      Bows - frostshot and knockback Q
      Frost - nova
      Fire - fire wall
      Curse - low cd root
      Crossbow- knockback and insane range E
      Almost all range weapons has much more advantages than melee
      Besides there’s always much more easy to kite with ranged than to catch enemy with melee