Huge concern regarding a stealth hellion shoes buff.

    • Huge concern regarding a stealth hellion shoes buff.

      In the recent patches i have encountered a bug: Mark of sacrifice (Hellion shoes) passes through Fire wall (Fire staffs).
      I have recorded the footage with my a buddy of mine and submitted the bug report couple days later on September 4th:

      Hattenhair wrote:

      The hotfix that went through yesterday made it so Mark of sacrifice (Hellion shoes) can pass through Fire wall (Fire staffs), despite the skill description not mentioning immunity to CC or being a blink-type skill.

      Please look into it asap.

      Video footage:

      The bug report was ignored until September 27th when i bumped the thread, after which i was given a reply by a member of SBI staff:

      Amoebius76 wrote:

      Hey there,

      this is working as intended. The description will be adjusted accordingly though.
      Now i have some statements to make:
      • The hellion shoes - fire wall interaction always ended in the hellion shoes user hitting the wall and getting feared until the Avalon patch hit live (introduction of CD's).
      • The balance change was not documented in the Live patch notes neither NDA patch notes.
      • The skill description suddenly became "incorrect" when i was answered to in the bug report.
      Archived NDA patch notes:
      web.archive.org/web/2020100214…lance-Playtests/?pageNo=1 (NDA, page 1)
      web.archive.org/web/2020100214…lance-Playtests/?pageNo=2 (NDA, page 2)

      Archived Avalon Live patch notes:
      web.archive.org/web/2020100214…20-Rise-of-Avalon-Update/ (Main patch, page 1)
      web.archive.org/web/2020100214…f-Avalon-Update/?pageNo=2 (Main patch, page 2)
      web.archive.org/web/2020100214…f-Avalon-Update/?pageNo=3 (Main patch, page 3)
      web.archive.org/web/2020100214…f-Avalon-Update-Hotfix-1/ (Main patch, Hotfix 1)
      web.archive.org/web/2020100214…0-Rise-of-Avalon-Patch-2/ (Patch 2)
      web.archive.org/web/2020100214…-Avalon-Patch-2-Hotfix-1/ (Patch 1, Hotfix 2)
      web.archive.org/web/2020100214…-Avalon-Patch-2-Hotfix-2/ (Patch 1, Hotfix 2)
      web.archive.org/web/2020100214…-Avalon-Patch-2-Hotfix-3/ (Patch 1, Hotfix 3)
      web.archive.org/web/2020100214…-Avalon-Patch-2-Hotfix-4/ (Patch 1, Hotfix 4)
      web.archive.org/web/2020100214…0-Rise-of-Avalon-Patch-3/ (Patch 3)
      web.archive.org/web/2020100214…0-Rise-of-Avalon-Patch-4/ (Patch 4, page 1)
      web.archive.org/web/2020100214…-Avalon-Patch-4/?pageNo=2 (Patch 4, page 2)
      web.archive.org/web/2020100215…0-Rise-of-Avalon-Patch-5/ (Patch 5)
      web.archive.org/web/2020100215…0-Rise-of-Avalon-Patch-6/ (Patch 6)

      Is SBI trying to close its eyes on a bug?
      Please discuss.
    • Neef wrote:

      Lol you really must be a fire player who died to a player because of this, you really went for it on this post. Lol I would like it to work to like it is currently to jump through the fire wall, Really you kinda fly to the target so you just fly right over baby and BOOM HELLO. Lol 8o
      How does a firemage counter the hellion shoes - black hands combo than?
      With a joke of a fart in a bottle that is Fire wave?
      Try to play against that setup in corrupts as a firemage, you cant do shit.

      Many items behave like "you kinda fly to the target", those are called dash-type skills:
      Dash (dagger W), Dual Swords E, Carving E, Bloodletter E, Deathgivers E and many more, all of the above are stopped by the wall.

      The point of the post is that im not content with the "stealth" buff of an item, the change was never documented yet i am in the "wrong".

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Hattenhair ().

    • Hattenhair wrote:

      Neef wrote:

      Lol you really must be a fire player who died to a player because of this, you really went for it on this post. Lol I would like it to work to like it is currently to jump through the fire wall, Really you kinda fly to the target so you just fly right over baby and BOOM HELLO. Lol 8o
      How does a firemage counter the hellion shoes - black hands combo than?With a joke of a fart in a bottle that is Fire wave?
      Try to play against that setup in corrupts as a firemage, you cant do shit.
      Adapt your playstyle, check for helion shoes and use fire wall after they use their shoes, many builds have to adapt to certain other builds. I don't see any reason why fire mage should not or can not adapt.
    • Iroshi wrote:

      Hattenhair wrote:

      Neef wrote:

      Lol you really must be a fire player who died to a player because of this, you really went for it on this post. Lol I would like it to work to like it is currently to jump through the fire wall, Really you kinda fly to the target so you just fly right over baby and BOOM HELLO. Lol 8o
      How does a firemage counter the hellion shoes - black hands combo than?With a joke of a fart in a bottle that is Fire wave?Try to play against that setup in corrupts as a firemage, you cant do shit.
      Adapt your playstyle, check for helion shoes and use fire wall after they use their shoes, many builds have to adapt to certain other builds. I don't see any reason why fire mage should not or can not adapt.
      Nice.
    • Hattenhair wrote:

      Neef wrote:

      Lol you really must be a fire player who died to a player because of this, you really went for it on this post. Lol I would like it to work to like it is currently to jump through the fire wall, Really you kinda fly to the target so you just fly right over baby and BOOM HELLO. Lol 8o
      How does a firemage counter the hellion shoes - black hands combo than?With a joke of a fart in a bottle that is Fire wave?
      Try to play against that setup in corrupts as a firemage, you cant do shit.

      Many items behave like "you kinda fly to the target", those are called dash-type skills:
      Dash (dagger W), Dual Swords E, Carving E, Bloodletter E, Deathgivers E and many more, all of the above are stopped by the wall.

      The point of the post is that im not content with the "stealth" buff of an item, the change was never documented yet i am in the "wrong".
      This is a good argument actually. I agree with you that those skills should be able to go past a fire wall - that skill is insane as is. Windwall should be changed too for consistency.
    • Bukem wrote:

      Hattenhair wrote:

      Neef wrote:

      Lol you really must be a fire player who died to a player because of this, you really went for it on this post. Lol I would like it to work to like it is currently to jump through the fire wall, Really you kinda fly to the target so you just fly right over baby and BOOM HELLO. Lol 8o
      How does a firemage counter the hellion shoes - black hands combo than?With a joke of a fart in a bottle that is Fire wave?Try to play against that setup in corrupts as a firemage, you cant do shit.

      Many items behave like "you kinda fly to the target", those are called dash-type skills:
      Dash (dagger W), Dual Swords E, Carving E, Bloodletter E, Deathgivers E and many more, all of the above are stopped by the wall.

      The point of the post is that im not content with the "stealth" buff of an item, the change was never documented yet i am in the "wrong".
      This is a good argument actually. I agree with you that those skills should be able to go past a fire wall - that skill is insane as is. Windwall should be changed too for consistency.
      Agreed Firewall is super good and very very very few things can counter it and go through it, Hellion shoes arn't used that much and some things should jump through it because its already super OP. No I am not a hellion shoe player but I believe everything should have a counter in some type of way and this should be one.
    • Bukem wrote:

      This is a good argument actually. I agree with you that those skills should be able to go past a fire wall - that skill is insane as is. Windwall should be changed too for consistency.

      Neef wrote:

      Agreed Firewall is super good and very very very few things can counter it and go through it, Hellion shoes arn't used that much and some things should jump through it because its already super OP. No I am not a hellion shoe player but I believe everything should have a counter in some type of way and this should be one.
      Daggers already have 2 W's with CC invulnerability during animation (Shadow edge and Chain slash)
      Also bear in mind that a firemage with firewall is left without a whole skill in a battle with a ranged build, as its practically unusable.

      Why arent you using "muh knight helmet" now? Is it too weak to counter something other than forced movement?
      I already made suggestions to buff items that have little use outside of specific scenarios.

      P.S @Bukem What a way to kill zoning and kiting in this game, since every meta "melee" has breakneck mobility.

      Also this is off topic again -_-
      Why wasnt the change documented anywhere? Its clearly a bug with how inconsistent it is.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Hattenhair ().

    • Hattenhair wrote:

      Bukem wrote:

      This is a good argument actually. I agree with you that those skills should be able to go past a fire wall - that skill is insane as is. Windwall should be changed too for consistency.

      Neef wrote:

      Agreed Firewall is super good and very very very few things can counter it and go through it, Hellion shoes arn't used that much and some things should jump through it because its already super OP. No I am not a hellion shoe player but I believe everything should have a counter in some type of way and this should be one.
      Daggers already have 2 W's with CC invulnerability during animation (Shadow edge and Chain slash)Also bear in mind that a firemage with firewall is left without a whole skill in a battle with a ranged build, as its practically unusable.

      Why arent you using "muh knight helmet" now? Is it too weak to counter something other than forced movement?
      I already made suggestions to buff items that have little use outside of specific scenarios.

      P.S @Bukem What a way to kill zoning and kiting in this game, since every meta "melee" has breakneck mobility.

      Also this is off topic again -_-
      Why wasnt the change documented anywhere? Its clearly a bug with how inconsistent it is.
      Yes but daggers is like one of the only counters and knight helm in anything but ZVZ is dog shit on a stick, Atleast give us a boot option to help us out and hellion shoes can fuck you too because you can only come in not get out most the time. So being that im melee all you have to do is use your boots to backup and I can't chase because I have already used my boots to get over your firewall. Seems fair to me.
    • Neef wrote:

      Yes but daggers is like one of the only counters and knight helm in anything but ZVZ is dog shit on a stick, Atleast give us a boot option to help us out and hellion shoes can fuck you too because you can only come in not get out most the time. So being that im melee all you have to do is use your boots to backup and I can't chase because I have already used my boots to get over your firewall. Seems fair to me.
      Alright then mister smarty pants, cook me up some ideas as to how we should buff firemage than.
      Your suggestion is literally introducing a counter to the only viable utility the firemage can play around.
      All utility the firemage has is:
      • Firewall (The only viable option)
      • Chili fart in a bottle (Half a meter knockback every 15s)
      • Ignite with 40% MS (And a gimped requirement to hit a target under 40% to trigger it)
      Meanwhile swords:
      • CC resistance (Claymore E)
      • I-Frames (Parry and Claymore E)
      • Reflect (Parry)
      • Purge resistance (Iron will)
      • Slow (W skill)
      • Root (W skill)
      • Interrupt (Broadsword E and W skill)
      • Resistances (Broadsword E)
      • Movespeed is literally a part of your Q slot
      Meanwhile daggers:
      • CC resistance (Chain slash and Shadow edge)
      • I-Frames (Chain slash and Shadow edge)
      • Stun (Shadow edge)
      • Movespeed (Spinning blades and 1h Dagger E)
      • Damage boost (Literally a part of 2 Q spells, Dash W and Spinning blades)
      • Armor break (Sunder armor Q)
      • Gap closers/dash skills/mobility (Shadow edge, Chain slash, Dash and literally a Q spell)
      • Healing reduction (Forbidden stab)
      • Purge, Stun and Knockback (Blackhands E; LMAOO THIS IS ONE BUTTON)
      • Lifesteal (1h Dagger E)
      • Invisibility (Deathgivers E)
      If you think the firewall needs more counters, so be it, but you have to offer something in return.
      If you really think firemage needs more nerfs you are fucking delusional.

      The post was edited 3 times, last by Hattenhair ().

    • Hattenhair wrote:

      Neef wrote:

      Yes but daggers is like one of the only counters and knight helm in anything but ZVZ is dog shit on a stick, Atleast give us a boot option to help us out and hellion shoes can fuck you too because you can only come in not get out most the time. So being that im melee all you have to do is use your boots to backup and I can't chase because I have already used my boots to get over your firewall. Seems fair to me.
      Alright then mister smarty pants, cook me up some ideas as to how we should buff firemage than.Your suggestion is literally introducing a counter to the only viable utility the firemage can play around.
      All utility the firemage has is:
      • Firewall (The only viable option)
      • Chili fart in a bottle (Half a meter knockback every 15s)
      • Ignite with 40% MS (And a gimped requirement to hit a target under 40% to trigger it)
      Meanwhile swords:
      • CC resistance (Claymore E)
      • I-Frames (Parry and Claymore E)
      • Reflect (Parry)
      • Purge resistance (Iron will)
      • Slow (W skill)
      • Root (W skill)
      • Interrupt (Broadsword E and W skill)
      • Resistances (Broadsword E)
      • Movespeed is literally a part of your Q slot
      Meanwhile daggers:
      • CC resistance (Chain slash and Shadow edge)
      • I-Frames (Chain slash and Shadow edge)
      • Stun (Shadow edge)
      • Movespeed (Spinning blades)
      • Damage boost (Literally a part of 2 Q spells, Dash W, Spinning blades and 1h Dagger E)
      • Armor break (Sunder armor Q)
      • Gap closers/dash skills/mobility (Shadow edge, Chain slash, Dash and literally a Q spell)
      • Healing reduction (Forbidden stab)
      • Purge, Stun and Knockback (Blackhands E; LMAOO THIS IS ONE BUTTON)
      • Lifesteal (1h Dagger E)
      • Invisibility (Deathgivers E)
      If you think the firewall needs more counters, so be it, but you have to offer something in return.
      If you really think firemage needs more nerfs you are fucking delusional.
      Lol so mad because like one thing can go over firewall and its not even used that much...
    • Hattenhair wrote:

      Neef wrote:

      Lol so mad because like one thing can go over firewall and its not even used that much...
      Yes, yes, I simply provided you with a comparison.Now please cook up something better than ''lmao umad''.
      Lol, Its a game relax. Its very debaitable that some things should pass firewall, Its a super great spell and it can total lock entry points at times, This isn't a dash or a slow, This is an ability that will always be good, Now hellion shoes are not used that much and I believe more than 1 option should be allowed. Isn't knight helm the only item that can allow you to pass.