Why aren't we talking about the HOLY tree?

    • Why aren't we talking about the HOLY tree?

      Hi--

      I get it, we updated the tree for mobility, but we still hit the biggest most rewarding heals... right? No. What about this new system is rewarding? I believe the new changes listed below would help with mobility and an overall better experience.

      Mainly, we lost the most rewarding stacking buff associated with flash heal. Each hit gave us a 10% buff. Hitting a that MASSIVE heal with a three stacked holy flash buff + weapon passive felt so good. It took practice, but it hit high and rewarded the player. We lost this completely. There's only a healing buff from the recently-nerfed holy blessing.

      I know players that played smite. MAINED SMITE. It's a ridiculous build, yes, but played right it is an incredible weapon. It was rewarding, but was hard to pull off. It's impossible to 1v1 a smite healer before this patch, and I understand that's why you changed smite from W to Q. Which literally destroyed every smite player ever. There's no heal to heal yourself on your w. No E to sustain what needs to be sustain a 1v1 fight, etc. I wonder if a smite build is even possible, and I wonder where my smite player friends went.



      What I want to see:

      Holy flash: love it. Great. Add range. Like 2-5 meters. I want it to hit the corners of my screen easily. Lower the heal. Yup. Lower it, but add a stacking buff that increases healing received by 2, 4, 6%. If you do not add a stacking ability you need to add a new spell, see below.

      Sacred Pulse: add a SMALL decaying AOE HOT. Bring the hot back. It was amazing as it's the only HOT Q/W. It felt good and even a small mindless HOT is fun for a healer. Please, literally please, why not? Reward the player for playing <3

      Divine Intervention: Great addition. Great Spell. Love it. Add a small decaying HOT, haha. I think any aoe healing spell should have an AOE hot. It just makes sense with the game. I mean the great holy staff is a big HOT, no? The divine gives a small exploding heal. It just makes sense to have some weird off shoot heal from "explosive" heals. I wouldn't add a small decaying HOT to the great holy~~

      Smite: move it back to w. Reduce the damage A LOT and increase mana A LOT. Easy fix. Literally done. That would crumble the viability to fight continuously and allow a player to win if they play extremely smart. Rewarding, difficult to play, BARELY viable -- NOT META. It's a troll build and it always will be. Give them the ability to catch those who mess up, which is rewarding. (EDIT: Also i'm not sure that damage was necessary on Sacred Pulse if we move smite to W)




      Add spells:

      If you do not add a stacking healing spell, I will be so sad. It's literally in every RPG game, why do you only have 1 small buff? (EDIT: I mean 1 small ability that applies a buff. Yes, there is also a holy-weapon passive that provides a small buff as well). You need more stacking abilities for holy. That's what it's all about. Play smart, hit massive heals, be rewarded. Play bad, hit small heals, die. :shrug:

      Q/W/E Walking Channel Spell (name tbd). Heal 1 targeted ally over 5 seconds. 8 meter range. Each second a 1% healing buff stack is applied up to 5 stacks. At the end of an uninterrupted channel, each stack should decay after 2-3 seconds. Don't make it a huge heal. It's about mobility. (E: Add "ghosting" ability that reduces damage received and make the healer unimpaired by CC).

      W "Holy Ground" instant-cast, uninterruptible, 1.5 second delay: a medium AOE heal around the healer and adds "holy ground" below the healers feet. It increases heals by 20%, increases MS for allies, and decreases MS for enemies. The ground follows the healer for up to 3 seconds.

      Q "Stack Heal" A SMALL HEAL, like super small targeted heal, that stacks the healing up three times: 3,6,9%. A 9% fully stacked "Stack Heal" should heal just above 1 generous heal. (EDIT: I imagine it should have the same mana to heal ratio as generous heal, if not a higher mana to heal ratio.)



      What do we think? Add abilities? Change anything? Add suggestions below.



      Thanks for reading,
      Relaehh
      Main Holy Staff :( It's just not really a viable staff anymore because it lost the stacking ability. Please buff the E if you don't :CRY:

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Zanzig ().

    • I love the idea of having a life-leach spell. Smite, or not. Maybe just remove smite and create a Life Leach Spell idk. Imagine an instant cast debuff/Dot on an enemy that allows the healer to regain health. Instacast because of mobility and is a good comparison to the cast-time spells. Kinda broken, but I like the idea! It would combat thorns >:}

      AGREED NATURE 5v5 is the new meta. 100% there's no viable option for holy in 5v5 anymore. There's just not enough sustain: healing ally sustain + personal mana. Allies are going to get sunk. There's just not enough peel/heal. They've basically nerfed sacred pulse. The holy staff E's are just not strong enough to compare anymore with Q/W changes. Fallen staff hits the biggest heals now, and legit is worthless. There's no mobility on the fallen. It's just a worse weapon now. The entire tree is more "mobile" meaning they can walk after casting for a moment, instead of spamming flash heal for example, but the amount of heals/peals have been reduced.
    • Zanzig wrote:

      Hi--

      I get it, we updated the tree for mobility, but we still hit the biggest most rewarding heals... right? No. What about this new system is rewarding? I believe the new changes listed below would help with mobility and an overall better experience.

      Mainly, we lost the most rewarding stacking buff associated with flash heal. Each hit gave us a 10% buff. Hitting a that MASSIVE heal with a three stacked holy flash buff + weapon passive felt so good. It took practice, but it hit high and rewarded the player. We lost this completely. There's only a healing buff from the recently-nerfed holy blessing.

      I know players that played smite. MAINED SMITE. It's a ridiculous build, yes, but played right it is an incredible weapon. It was rewarding, but was hard to pull off. It's impossible to 1v1 a smite healer before this patch, and I understand that's why you changed smite from W to Q. Which literally destroyed every smite player ever. There's no heal to heal yourself on your w. No E to sustain what needs to be sustain a 1v1 fight, etc. I wonder if a smite build is even possible, and I wonder where my smite player friends went.



      What I want to see:

      Holy flash: love it. Great. Add range. Like 2-5 meters. I want it to hit the corners of my screen easily. Lower the heal. Yup. Lower it, but add a stacking buff that increases healing received by 2, 4, 6%. If you do not add a stacking ability you need to add a new spell, see below.

      Sacred Pulse: add a SMALL decaying AOE HOT. Bring the hot back. It was amazing as it's the only HOT Q/W. It felt good and even a small mindless HOT is fun for a healer. Please, literally please, why not? Reward the player for playing <3

      Divine Intervention: Great addition. Great Spell. Love it. Add a small decaying HOT, haha. I think any aoe healing spell should have an AOE hot. It just makes sense with the game. I mean the great holy staff is a big HOT, no? The divine gives a small exploding heal. It just makes sense to have some weird off shoot heal from "explosive" heals. I wouldn't add a small decaying HOT to the great holy~~

      Smite: move it back to w. Reduce the damage A LOT and increase mana A LOT. Easy fix. Literally done. That would crumble the viability to fight continuously and allow a player to win if they play extremely smart. Rewarding, difficult to play, BARELY viable -- NOT META. It's a troll build and it always will be. Give them the ability to catch those who mess up, which is rewarding. (EDIT: Also i'm not sure that damage was necessary on Sacred Pulse if we move smite to W)




      Add spells:

      If you do not add a stacking healing spell, I will be so sad. It's literally in every RPG game, why do you only have 1 small buff? You need more stacking abilities for holy. That's what it's all about. Play smart, hit massive heals, be rewarded. Play bad, hit small heals, die. :shrug:

      Q/W/E Walking Channel Spell (name tbd). Heal 1 targeted ally over 5 seconds. 8 meter range. Each second a 1% healing buff stack is applied up to 5 stacks. At the end of an uninterrupted channel, each stack should decay after 2-3 seconds. Don't make it a huge heal. It's about mobility. (E: Add "ghosting" ability that reduces damage received and make the healer unimpaired by CC).

      W "Holy Ground" instant-cast, uninterruptible, 1.5 second delay: a medium AOE heal around the healer and adds "holy ground" below the healers feet. It increases heals by 20%, increases MS for allies, and decreases MS for enemies. The ground follows the healer for up to 3 seconds.

      Q "Stack Heal" A SMALL HEAL like super small heal, that stacks the healing up from 3,6,9% a 9% fully stacked "Stacked Heal" should heal just above 1 generous heal.



      What do we think? Add abilities? Change anything? Add suggestions below.



      Thanks for reading,
      Relaehh
      Main Holy Staff :( It's just not really a viable staff anymore because it lost the stacking ability. Please buff the E if you don't :CRY:
      what do you mean remove smite

      i can't believe what i'm reading
      » ᴘ ᴇ ɴ ɢ ᴜ ɪ ɴ • s ɴ ɪ ᴘ ᴇ ʀ «
    • PenguinSniper wrote:

      Zanzig wrote:

      Hi--

      I get it, we updated the tree for mobility, but we still hit the biggest most rewarding heals... right? No. What about this new system is rewarding? I believe the new changes listed below would help with mobility and an overall better experience.

      Mainly, we lost the most rewarding stacking buff associated with flash heal. Each hit gave us a 10% buff. Hitting a that MASSIVE heal with a three stacked holy flash buff + weapon passive felt so good. It took practice, but it hit high and rewarded the player. We lost this completely. There's only a healing buff from the recently-nerfed holy blessing.

      I know players that played smite. MAINED SMITE. It's a ridiculous build, yes, but played right it is an incredible weapon. It was rewarding, but was hard to pull off. It's impossible to 1v1 a smite healer before this patch, and I understand that's why you changed smite from W to Q. Which literally destroyed every smite player ever. There's no heal to heal yourself on your w. No E to sustain what needs to be sustain a 1v1 fight, etc. I wonder if a smite build is even possible, and I wonder where my smite player friends went.



      What I want to see:

      Holy flash: love it. Great. Add range. Like 2-5 meters. I want it to hit the corners of my screen easily. Lower the heal. Yup. Lower it, but add a stacking buff that increases healing received by 2, 4, 6%. If you do not add a stacking ability you need to add a new spell, see below.

      Sacred Pulse: add a SMALL decaying AOE HOT. Bring the hot back. It was amazing as it's the only HOT Q/W. It felt good and even a small mindless HOT is fun for a healer. Please, literally please, why not? Reward the player for playing <3

      Divine Intervention: Great addition. Great Spell. Love it. Add a small decaying HOT, haha. I think any aoe healing spell should have an AOE hot. It just makes sense with the game. I mean the great holy staff is a big HOT, no? The divine gives a small exploding heal. It just makes sense to have some weird off shoot heal from "explosive" heals. I wouldn't add a small decaying HOT to the great holy~~

      Smite: move it back to w. Reduce the damage A LOT and increase mana A LOT. Easy fix. Literally done. That would crumble the viability to fight continuously and allow a player to win if they play extremely smart. Rewarding, difficult to play, BARELY viable -- NOT META. It's a troll build and it always will be. Give them the ability to catch those who mess up, which is rewarding. (EDIT: Also i'm not sure that damage was necessary on Sacred Pulse if we move smite to W)




      Add spells:

      If you do not add a stacking healing spell, I will be so sad. It's literally in every RPG game, why do you only have 1 small buff? You need more stacking abilities for holy. That's what it's all about. Play smart, hit massive heals, be rewarded. Play bad, hit small heals, die. :shrug:

      Q/W/E Walking Channel Spell (name tbd). Heal 1 targeted ally over 5 seconds. 8 meter range. Each second a 1% healing buff stack is applied up to 5 stacks. At the end of an uninterrupted channel, each stack should decay after 2-3 seconds. Don't make it a huge heal. It's about mobility. (E: Add "ghosting" ability that reduces damage received and make the healer unimpaired by CC).

      W "Holy Ground" instant-cast, uninterruptible, 1.5 second delay: a medium AOE heal around the healer and adds "holy ground" below the healers feet. It increases heals by 20%, increases MS for allies, and decreases MS for enemies. The ground follows the healer for up to 3 seconds.

      Q "Stack Heal" A SMALL HEAL like super small heal, that stacks the healing up from 3,6,9% a 9% fully stacked "Stacked Heal" should heal just above 1 generous heal.



      What do we think? Add abilities? Change anything? Add suggestions below.



      Thanks for reading,
      Relaehh
      Main Holy Staff :( It's just not really a viable staff anymore because it lost the stacking ability. Please buff the E if you don't :CRY:
      what do you mean remove smite
      i can't believe what i'm reading
      I agree. Don't remove it.

      Maybe add another DPS option, like life leech.
    • Sinwut wrote:

      i'm a smite main & all sustain has been removed from holy. you either heal or dps no in-between and it utterly sucks. ruined the game for me tbh my play style no longer exists after this update.

      if not purged i can kill 1500+ ip players with 5 smites. yes 600 / smite.
      EXACTLY what i'm talking about. They need to change smite back to w, add mana cost, reduce damage. Ez fix.... I don't get the Q move...
    • Zanzig wrote:

      Sinwut wrote:

      i'm a smite main & all sustain has been removed from holy. you either heal or dps no in-between and it utterly sucks. ruined the game for me tbh my play style no longer exists after this update.

      if not purged i can kill 1500+ ip players with 5 smites. yes 600 / smite.
      EXACTLY what i'm talking about. They need to change smite back to w, add mana cost, reduce damage. Ez fix.... I don't get the Q move...
      they just nerfing us to the ground because one guy in one of the big guilds got killed like this and they make all the decisions. so the rest of the player base suffers.
    • I can't believe this is happening.

      If a Holy is too OP for corrupted dungeons, then forbid us from entering that thing. It would be better than to have to play with this new build.

      With these changes, I might be a healer, yet I cannot heal myself. This focus on group healing is awful, basically the holy healer became what the nature healer was, but without HOT. If I can not heal myself in solo or group fight I'm basically a sitting duck, since healers are always focused.

      Flash heal was way better than generous heal, generous heal is an awful spell, it takes too long to cast and in intense combat that means death. Holy bean is only for PVE, holy orb is useless, no one uses it. No one uses revive either, unless you are facing a really powerful and difficult boss, yet it has no use in PVP.

      Good holy healers (mostly) rely basically on flash heals + holy pulse or flash heal + holy blessing, yet this is not as good anymore, as it lost most of the armor bonus a while ago.So, basically, while Nature gets a staff with shares and increases heals, or divide and increases damage, we lose our best (and possibly only) healing ability and our sustain through self heal? I hate this new expansion. Won't even be able to run solo dungeons anymore, since smite takes so long to cast, and with no sustain there's no way to run it solo.

      In fact, holy healers are a support class/build which at the moment manages to have some survivability in solo, although not perfect. Yet, with this new expansion you developers want to make it a fighting class, which for now means scraping it to the trash can for good.

      I'd rather never enter a corrupted dungeon and get a rework on revive and holy orb than this new "holy healer"....

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Jahlapeno ().

    • Holy is fine at single target healing with generous heal, still way better single target burst healing than nature.

      The sacred pulse change will hurt single target healing but can always use 1h holy to recover single target burst if needed. Smite on q just brings holy in line with nature - cant have spammable heal and damage at same time.

      Sacred pulse does a pretty big damage hit now (just a little less than chain slash) so yet to see if holy will really be that much worst off in pvp.

      Holy orb is actually really good for 5v5 or more fights but no one used cause sacred pule knock back + big hot was just the best in almost every situation.

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Lockemup ().

    • Lockemup wrote:

      Holy is fine at single target healing with generous heal, still way better single target burst healing than nature.
      Yeah, right, try that while being focused on arena, facing off a purple tank or getting dived in a solo dungeon by a dagger/bloodletter/carving sword.... Holy flash is the best healing spell hands down, specially because it has a building buff and heals AOE every 4th spell cast. Every veteran holy healer knows this.

      The main problem that I see with holy orbs is that it activates on first ally hit, not on point cast. This nulifies it on most situations, since theres little control over it.

      Sacred pulse was the funniest spell to use. It was also one of the only way to heal a friend and keep on moving, or heal him and then focus healing on another ally. Sometimes it would come on handy when being ganked by strong parties on the road, but would not always work. The idea of sacred pulse was healing and defense, it gave you some time to breath, so it had nothing to do with damage. This damage idea is simply awful. Damage is smite not sacred pulse....

      This new "flash heal" abomination also has mouse directed cast. If the idea was to keep on moving this won't work, because on an intense fight.... Well it is not possible to have the mouse pointer in two different places (click to move, then point where you want to heal - allies are dead).


      The thing is that holy had mainly four spells: holy flash, sacred pulse, holy blessing and smite.

      Now, instead of getting a rework on the other spells no one used, we are having our four main and best spells scraped.

      This update creates a NEW BUILD. The hundred of hours we've invested in our build will be lost.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Jahlapeno ().

    • Jahlapeno wrote:

      Lockemup wrote:

      Holy is fine at single target healing with generous heal, still way better single target burst healing than nature.
      Yeah, right, try that while being focused on arena, facing off a purple tank or getting dived in a solo dungeon by a dagger/blood letter/carving sword.... Holy flash is the best healing spell hands down, specially because it has a building buff and heals AOE every 4th spell cast. Every veteran holy healer knows this.
      The main problem that I see with holy orbs is that it actives on first target hit, not on point cast. This nulifies it on most situations, since theres little control over it.

      Sacred pulse was the funniest spell to use. It was also one of the only way to heal a friend and keep moving, or heal him and then focus healing on another ally. Sometimes it would come handy when being ganked by strong parties on the road, but would not always work. The idea of sacred pulse was healing and defense, it gave you sometime to breath, so it has nothing to do with damage. This damage idea is simply awful.

      This new "flash heal" abomination also has mouse directed cast. If the idea was to keep on moving this won't work, because on an intense fight.... Well it is not possible to have the mouse pointer in two different places (click to move, then point where you want to heal - allies are dead).


      The thing is that holy had mainly four spells: holy flash, sacred pulse, holy blessing and smite.

      Now, instead of getting a rework on the other as no use used, we are having our four main and best spells scraped.

      This update creates a NEW BUILD. The hundred of hours we've invested in our build will be lost.
      100% agree
    • I don't understand why you guys are mad about the flash heal changes, I went on test server the other day and the new flash heal is a mini fallen heal and its pretty damn decent, You can spam it still and heal 5 people the circle is just a bit smaller then the fallen heal plus you can spam it, It seems like the old flash but better to me, 100% going to be the new zvz Q and most likely the new Q for crystals, I'm not sure if its great for 2v2 or 5v5 hgs but guys it needs to be tested before you go bitching about it, Also smite may have been removed from the W BUT they did add dmg to one of the W spells and it also can heal, plus moved smite to the Q so you can really do more dmg then before. I believe 2 handed holy plus smite Q plus the dmg/heal W with the knockback aoe heal could really do some work.Hell fallen could do some work with the smite Q dmg/heal AOE W and the aoe E. I could be all wrong but this is just what I seen for myself on the test server and I have been a holy healer since launch. I believe the new holy could find some good builds for solo play and 2v2 hgs but hell it needs to be tested period. Also wanted to add that holy has never been a very moible healing class and I believe for they way I play holy it has only helped and I have been a healer forever. I always hated flash heal and but thats just me.

      The post was edited 5 times, last by Neef ().

    • If the developer-gods of Albion are up to punish us for our sins and throw our build away, may we at least try to suggest something new.... May Saint Rosalia help us.

      Smite on Q
      Reduce cast time a bit and damage and mana cost in proportion, only to add mobility. It takes too long to cast this spell, and it is the only offensive spell we have. But it is a great spell, although it requires a lot of dedication and patience to learn how to use.


      Flash heal stays, or this new holy flash spell gets the bonus from flash heal. It is a mess to move and cast in hectic combat situations this new "holy flash", because it is impossible for your mouse pointer to be two different places at the same time. So this mobility intention won't work.


      Holy blessing gets its armour bonus and duration back, but mana cost should increase.

      Holy beam arches through allies, but healing does not keep on stacking, or if it increases, increases way less. If cast on self, gives caster a shield for cast duration (to make it different from rejuvenation/cannot outlast spell duration).


      Holy orbs explodes on point cast, not on first ally hit.


      Revive gets scraped. Suggestions:

      * AOE dispel, to remove both buffs and debuffs in an area ( "dispel magic", so can't choose. It purges all effects). Similar to Warcraft III priest's dispel magic.

      * Some kind of wind walk/ethereal form (can cast spells with reduced efficiency, cannot attack or cast smite).

      * Some aura which increases allies defenses.

      * Some "second chance" ability by which, if an ally dies while the effect is active, it revives him/her a while later (like Khepri's ultimate on SMITE). Just a suggestion close to the idea of the original revive, although this could obviously prove problematic.


      Another thing: give leather chests a twerk, because every DPS now uses cloth. Cloth has basically no defense and it's a pain to heal them all the time.

      Yet another thing: maybe if instead of insta-killed upon reaching 0 or less HPs, players could become knocked down and start "bleeding" for a duration. They would die if not helped by an ally within X amount of time or get executed by another player (similar to death mechanic in PUBG, Free Fire, etc). This would still keep the full loot experience, but it would make near death experience in game more interesting.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Jahlapeno ().

    • Neef wrote:

      I don't understand why you guys are mad about the flash heal changes, I went on test server the other day and the new flash heal is a mini fallen heal and its pretty damn decent, You can spam it still and heal 5 people the circle is just a bit smaller then the fallen heal plus you can spam it, It seems like the old flash but better to me, 100% going to be the new zvz Q and most likely the new Q for crystals, I'm not sure if its great for 2v2 or 5v5 hgs but guys it needs to be tested before you go bitching about it, Also smite may have been removed from the W BUT they did add dmg to one of the W spells and it also can heal, plus moved smite to the Q so you can really do more dmg then before. I believe 2 handed holy plus smite Q plus the dmg/heal W with the knockback aoe heal could really do some work.Hell fallen could do some work with the smite Q dmg/heal AOE W and the aoe E. I could be all wrong but this is just what I seen for myself on the test server and I have been a holy healer since launch. I believe the new holy could find some good builds for solo play and 2v2 hgs but hell it needs to be tested period. Also wanted to add that holy has never been a very moible healing class and I believe for they way I play holy it has only helped and I have been a healer forever. I always hated flash heal and but thats just me.
      If you have been to the test server, then you've noticed that even if you are a high spec holy and use gear above level of a given dungeon (corrupted or not) you will be running it on low health all the time....
    • Jahlapeno wrote:

      Neef wrote:

      I don't understand why you guys are mad about the flash heal changes, I went on test server the other day and the new flash heal is a mini fallen heal and its pretty damn decent, You can spam it still and heal 5 people the circle is just a bit smaller then the fallen heal plus you can spam it, It seems like the old flash but better to me, 100% going to be the new zvz Q and most likely the new Q for crystals, I'm not sure if its great for 2v2 or 5v5 hgs but guys it needs to be tested before you go bitching about it, Also smite may have been removed from the W BUT they did add dmg to one of the W spells and it also can heal, plus moved smite to the Q so you can really do more dmg then before. I believe 2 handed holy plus smite Q plus the dmg/heal W with the knockback aoe heal could really do some work.Hell fallen could do some work with the smite Q dmg/heal AOE W and the aoe E. I could be all wrong but this is just what I seen for myself on the test server and I have been a holy healer since launch. I believe the new holy could find some good builds for solo play and 2v2 hgs but hell it needs to be tested period. Also wanted to add that holy has never been a very moible healing class and I believe for they way I play holy it has only helped and I have been a healer forever. I always hated flash heal and but thats just me.
      If you have been to the test server, then you've noticed that even if you are a high spec holy and use gear above level of a given dungeon (corrupted or not) you will be running it on low health all the time....
      ROFL I was about to post on here because I just ran some corrupted dungs and solo and I was full HP almost the whole time, I ran lifetouch with Smite Q and Sacred Pulse W, and I rarely had to use my E, I even solo'd some chests in the ava raods and did some t8 solo dungs with NO problem what so ever, Infact its better for solo faming then before, My god is it much easier to fame, Hell the W is healing me for over 200 plus does over 300 dmg LOW CD and knocks mobs/players back to get a nice smite in. With spell casting passive its so good. I was also using guarden helm but didn't use it that much either, Though you could easliy use it too, Lifetouch also has the cleanse so its going to be pretty strong 1v1 with the right build. I really like the knockback and the dmg its a nice intruped and will knock melee dps off you to give you time to get some free smites, same with mobs.

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Neef ().