Solo Dungeons closing in red & black zones

    • how indignant are real pvp players who, apart from solo pvp dungeons, have never taken part in pvp anywhere. In the game, a sea of pvp content-ganks, hell gates, battle in the crystal league, faction wars. Are you missing? 5-10 people go to kill alone in single dungeons. Real alpha males. But when they themselves go to get fame in random or static dungeons they take Scout: Why isn't anyone crying that group dungeons and Avalon are a safe place to get fame? Where is the justice?
    • Then you need to make getting a fame in group dungeons not safe. Start banning everyone who uses scouts. The whole group that receives a fame with a scout at the entrance. But no one considers scouts a problem. And safe group farming in random and static dungeons is very good. in solo dungeons this is very bad. Double standards. I have everything. The developers are 100,000% right
    • Boompak wrote:

      how indignant are real pvp players who, apart from solo pvp dungeons, have never taken part in pvp anywhere. In the game, a sea of pvp content-ganks, hell gates, battle in the crystal league, faction wars. Are you missing? 5-10 people go to kill alone in single dungeons. Real alpha males. But when they themselves go to get fame in random or static dungeons they take Scout: Why isn't anyone crying that group dungeons and Avalon are a safe place to get fame? Where is the justice?
      The only indignant that I see with this change are the SRD farmers for all the rewards it brought (chance of fame, loot and PvP).As I said, you delude yourself that it will motivate people to the black zone. Where do you think the 10 who have plunged into dungeons in the past will go? If not to gank in the open world.
    • Gratinus wrote:

      The only indignant that I see with this change are the SRD farmers for all the rewards it brought (chance of fame, loot and PvP).As I said, you delude yourself that it will motivate people to the black zone. Where do you think the 10 who have plunged into dungeons in the past will go? If not to gank in the open world.
      Carebears will just use dungeons what are next to hideouts, you are not getting ganked anymore in BZs if you are a part of zone owning or renting group.
      Now, you can't even get dived.
      ZvZ or ganking of unaware newbies by 10+ groups of carebears are only ways you are allowed to play, the Only Correct Way to Play™ by SBI.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Vesen ().

    • I feel like most people commenting on this thread in favor of leaving it the same have literally never done an HCE, I think I've personally done like 2 and decided it was boring. I also don't run group dungeons, the only thing I do is an avalonian once a week because it feels necessary. My fame used to come from literally wandering around a t7 zone in Cumbria killing open world packs hoping to run into other people doing similar, solo dungeons finally let the majority of my fights to be somewhat limited in scope. No longer did I have to wait through 3-4 dire wolf gank squad deaths for the 1v1 or 1v2 over the zone timed chest once an hour.

      I also have no clue where you guys are getting so consistently ganked in solos, I farm solo in t7/t8 all the time and some days I go hours without any pvp content period. I see a lot of people making really common mistakes that leads to them getting killed.

      -Always leave the first few mobs of every dungeon alive, while some gank groups check past them most don't and will leave you be. The only people who will clear past them is other people looking to run dungeons so you are much more likely to get fair fights.

      -Don't run a farm kit, run either a kit you want to pvp in or at the very least a high mobility kit to run. When running from a large group make sure you walk past them normally without speed before popping your escape stuff. If you dont get them at your back before trying to run out half your speed is wasted on getting past them and not putting distance between you. (for sure pop any defensive/potions for this phase or you will just die)

      -Eat soup for health regen but have combat food equipped so you can eat upon seeing names. ( I don't even do this one because Im lazy but honestly I should)

      I play every other day for a few hours in solo dungeons and I only die a few times a month at most so I have no idea what zones you guys are farming in but you should consider moving further away from portal zones.
    • Boompak wrote:

      how indignant are real pvp players who, apart from solo pvp dungeons, have never taken part in pvp anywhere. In the game, a sea of pvp content-ganks, hell gates, battle in the crystal league, faction wars. Are you missing? 5-10 people go to kill alone in single dungeons. Real alpha males. But when they themselves go to get fame in random or static dungeons they take Scout: Why isn't anyone crying that group dungeons and Avalon are a safe place to get fame? Where is the justice?
      The vast majority of dungeon PVP is 1v1, 2v1 or 2v2. Every now and then you see 3 players, and this '5v1' PVP thing is a complete strawman that happens maybe 1 in 200 dungeons at most, and typically because they saw you go in and pinged their mates who were busy ganking.

      You've mentioned a sea of PVP content, but really, if you and a friend want to go PVP, what are your choices? Ganks are legitimately 5-10 v 1 no skill brainless content and it's 99% boredom. Hellgates are a 5 minute gameplay loop with set meta builds & mostly cheap trash gear that you do over and over and spend just as much time running loot back & forward to the hellgate as you do fighting (corrupted dungeons look to be similar, but that's a no-go if you want to play socially with friends anyway). Crystal League needs specifically five and again are just instanced fights with meta builds that are pretty boring compared to just playing League. Faction wars are cool but hardly constant PVP and mostly involving firing out AOE until the bigger zerg wins with people ratting corpses left and right. Similar to ZVZ, though that's a little better since you're in comm's with the rest of your team, there's still not a lot of variety to the actual combat loop & they involve an obnoxious amount of standing around waiting.

      1v2 / 2v2's in Dungeons are the most exciting and varied form of PVP out there - you come across all sorts of builds & combinations in tons of different situations, and you never know if a fight is going to come in your first dungeon or when you decide to do one more with a bag full of loot before you head home. You also fight people who are using real gear so they can clear quickly, instead of someone just hoping you don't have a purge for their 4-0 Bow & hunter hood combo. The PVE / fame grind is something you do to progress your character between fights, it's not the sole purpose of dungeoning (and to everyone who wants to fame farm in peace, what's the point if you're only ever going to fight 10 man gank squads?)

      Having solo dungeons without PVP seems akin to running rifts in Diablo 3 for an hour, and anyone who's put time into that game knows that you play it for maybe a week or two when a new patch comes out and then drop it because there's absolutely no depth to the experience and it's just mindlessly grinding numbers for the sake of it. Is that really what we want the blackzone to become?

      In fact, forget the comparison - go run some yellow zone dungeons with a friend for 2 hours and then ignoring fame/loot, think about if you could really sustain that as your main gameplay loop over the coming months without being bored out of your mind.

      Dungeons need the variety of unpredictable, tense & meaningful fights, & this is a nail in the coffin for small scale 2 person content.
    • Gratinus wrote:

      Hollywoodi wrote:

      @Korn

      My friend, it is as if sometimes you stand in the middle of a big forest and search for trees.

      With Avalonian portals you have everything to create wonderfully SRD experience.

      Just add the mechanic of the 2 people then recharge mechanic to SRD or even GRD.

      For SRD: One player can enter, portal allows ONE more to enter, so one diver okay.. then portal needs to recharge for 3 mins..

      Done

      For GRD depending on Tier of dungeon: T8 group of 6? Can enter intially. Then portal is in spawn mode, means another 6 can enter then it needs recharge for like 5 mins..

      Done

      On top u use existing mechanic and code of roads of Avalon..
      Yes, it's the perfect solution, timer for SRD and RDG! Please implement this.
      I just can recommend it, but as most time, they have a better idea.. unfortunately for me..
    • Bukem wrote:

      Boompak wrote:

      how indignant are real pvp players who, apart from solo pvp dungeons, have never taken part in pvp anywhere. In the game, a sea of pvp content-ganks, hell gates, battle in the crystal league, faction wars. Are you missing? 5-10 people go to kill alone in single dungeons. Real alpha males. But when they themselves go to get fame in random or static dungeons they take Scout: Why isn't anyone crying that group dungeons and Avalon are a safe place to get fame? Where is the justice?
      The vast majority of dungeon PVP is 1v1, 2v1 or 2v2. Every now and then you see 3 players, and this '5v1' PVP thing is a complete strawman that happens maybe 1 in 200 dungeons at most, and typically because they saw you go in and pinged their mates who were busy ganking.
      You've mentioned a sea of PVP content, but really, if you and a friend want to go PVP, what are your choices? Ganks are legitimately 5-10 v 1 no skill brainless content and it's 99% boredom. Hellgates are a 5 minute gameplay loop with set meta builds & mostly cheap trash gear that you do over and over and spend just as much time running loot back & forward to the hellgate as you do fighting (corrupted dungeons look to be similar, but that's a no-go if you want to play socially with friends anyway). Crystal League needs specifically five and again are just instanced fights with meta builds that are pretty boring compared to just playing League. Faction wars are cool but hardly constant PVP and mostly involving firing out AOE until the bigger zerg wins with people ratting corpses left and right. Similar to ZVZ, though that's a little better since you're in comm's with the rest of your team, there's still not a lot of variety to the actual combat loop & they involve an obnoxious amount of standing around waiting.

      1v2 / 2v2's in Dungeons are the most exciting and varied form of PVP out there - you come across all sorts of builds & combinations in tons of different situations, and you never know if a fight is going to come in your first dungeon or when you decide to do one more with a bag full of loot before you head home. You also fight people who are using real gear so they can clear quickly, instead of someone just hoping you don't have a purge for their 4-0 Bow & hunter hood combo. The PVE / fame grind is something you do to progress your character between fights, it's not the sole purpose of dungeoning (and to everyone who wants to fame farm in peace, what's the point if you're only ever going to fight 10 man gank squads?)

      Having solo dungeons without PVP seems akin to running rifts in Diablo 3 for an hour, and anyone who's put time into that game knows that you play it for maybe a week or two when a new patch comes out and then drop it because there's absolutely no depth to the experience and it's just mindlessly grinding numbers for the sake of it. Is that really what we want the blackzone to become?

      In fact, forget the comparison - go run some yellow zone dungeons with a friend for 2 hours and then ignoring fame/loot, think about if you could really sustain that as your main gameplay loop over the coming months without being bored out of your mind.

      Dungeons need the variety of unpredictable, tense & meaningful fights, & this is a nail in the coffin for small scale 2 person content.
      i agree. Dive SRD is most exciting pvp. one half HP and CD skill with mob agroed vs 1, 2, 3 or more pvp ganker full life and cd ready to kill. Nice content. PVP fair gameplay. I like. Come guys, the gank doenst end, you will catch SRD player outside in open world same as today. You are beg to SBI maintain this coward and easymode kind of gank.
    • Bukem wrote:

      Boompak wrote:

      how indignant are real pvp players who, apart from solo pvp dungeons, have never taken part in pvp anywhere. In the game, a sea of pvp content-ganks, hell gates, battle in the crystal league, faction wars. Are you missing? 5-10 people go to kill alone in single dungeons. Real alpha males. But when they themselves go to get fame in random or static dungeons they take Scout: Why isn't anyone crying that group dungeons and Avalon are a safe place to get fame? Where is the justice?
      The vast majority of dungeon PVP is 1v1, 2v1 or 2v2. Every now and then you see 3 players, and this '5v1' PVP thing is a complete strawman that happens maybe 1 in 200 dungeons at most, and typically because they saw you go in and pinged their mates who were busy ganking.
      You've mentioned a sea of PVP content, but really, if you and a friend want to go PVP, what are your choices? Ganks are legitimately 5-10 v 1 no skill brainless content and it's 99% boredom. Hellgates are a 5 minute gameplay loop with set meta builds & mostly cheap trash gear that you do over and over and spend just as much time running loot back & forward to the hellgate as you do fighting (corrupted dungeons look to be similar, but that's a no-go if you want to play socially with friends anyway). Crystal League needs specifically five and again are just instanced fights with meta builds that are pretty boring compared to just playing League. Faction wars are cool but hardly constant PVP and mostly involving firing out AOE until the bigger zerg wins with people ratting corpses left and right. Similar to ZVZ, though that's a little better since you're in comm's with the rest of your team, there's still not a lot of variety to the actual combat loop & they involve an obnoxious amount of standing around waiting.

      1v2 / 2v2's in Dungeons are the most exciting and varied form of PVP out there - you come across all sorts of builds & combinations in tons of different situations, and you never know if a fight is going to come in your first dungeon or when you decide to do one more with a bag full of loot before you head home. You also fight people who are using real gear so they can clear quickly, instead of someone just hoping you don't have a purge for their 4-0 Bow & hunter hood combo. The PVE / fame grind is something you do to progress your character between fights, it's not the sole purpose of dungeoning (and to everyone who wants to fame farm in peace, what's the point if you're only ever going to fight 10 man gank squads?)

      Having solo dungeons without PVP seems akin to running rifts in Diablo 3 for an hour, and anyone who's put time into that game knows that you play it for maybe a week or two when a new patch comes out and then drop it because there's absolutely no depth to the experience and it's just mindlessly grinding numbers for the sake of it. Is that really what we want the blackzone to become?

      In fact, forget the comparison - go run some yellow zone dungeons with a friend for 2 hours and then ignoring fame/loot, think about if you could really sustain that as your main gameplay loop over the coming months without being bored out of your mind.

      Dungeons need the variety of unpredictable, tense & meaningful fights, & this is a nail in the coffin for small scale 2 person content.
      I repeat once again, they go to single dungeons for the sake of fame and loot. 98% of group dungeons are worth scouts and this allows you to get fame and loot without any risk. What can solo players do? Oh, you can dive them in 3-6 people, you alpha males. But as it comes to honest pvp, hell gate and crystal, all enthusiasm disappears, because there are guys in "meta builds".
    • Gemivl wrote:

      А зачем вы тогда добавляли черные локации, если делаете из них такую же фигню как и в жёлтых и синих, черные локации на то и черные что в них должно быть опасно.
      В авалонских данжах очень опасно фармить,в групповых со скаутом очень опасно фармить?А где фармить соло игрокам?Нужно делать что-то со скаутами.А потом уже говорить,что должен быть риск.А сейчас крайне несправедливо все.Поэтому разрабы делают все правильно.Я ещё не слышал адекватного аргумента почему не пойти в новый хг1х1 если ты тру дайвер и дайвишь в соло.А если ты собираешь компашку и вы в 5рыл ищете соло фармеров,думаю ты и сам понимаешь кто ты.
    • Equart wrote:

      @Korn I like this change, but with one remark.

      1. Implement this change for 1 month and collect data. But only in September , the reason behind it is only one - in August people will be hyped and will do new content non-stop , plus global population would be much higher.
      2. Compare PvP activity , how it was before and how it is now.
      3. If PvP activity will be the same (In SRD) , or higher - keep this change. If it will be lower - cancel this change.

      Also i want to add - make 4-5 min timer, 1 min is too low.
    • Equart wrote:

      Equart wrote:

      @Korn I like this change, but with one remark.

      1. Implement this change for 1 month and collect data. But only in September , the reason behind it is only one - in August people will be hyped and will do new content non-stop , plus global population would be much higher.
      2. Compare PvP activity , how it was before and how it is now.
      3. If PvP activity will be the same (In SRD) , or higher - keep this change. If it will be lower - cancel this change.

      Also i want to add - make 4-5 min timer, 1 min is too low.
      Hey there,

      that's our approach. Implement the change, collect the data, and take it from there. As explained in my statement further up, our goal is to increase total PvP activity in the black zones. If the change leads to more solo RDs being played by a wider portion of the player base, the fact that individual ganks are harder to pull of will be compensated by a much higher number of ganking opportunities.

      We are aware that 1 min as a starting point is on the lowest end. That's because it will allow us to get conclusive data right away - if we started with, say, 5 minutes, chances are that any data we'd get would be inconclusive as it most likely won't have any noticeable impact.
    • @Korn And did you consider idea to add such change/rule only for BZ? Because in my opinion RZ are fine , they got enough instruments to control dives,not bad population and nice PvP activity , plus there is no problems with scouts in solo dungeons like we have in blackzones.

      P.S Also i'm asking you not forget that PvP/PvE experience is totally different if we compare Rz and Bz , for new and old players. All that i'm trying to say is that there is no sense to change something that is working pretty fine. (again from my perspective)

      Because in my imagination such changes , i mean adding this rule to BZ and RZ , might help BlackZones in a good way, but will negatively affect Red Zones.

      The post was edited 3 times, last by Equart ().

    • Equart wrote:

      Equart wrote:

      @Korn I like this change, but with one remark.

      1. Implement this change for 1 month and collect data. But only in September , the reason behind it is only one - in August people will be hyped and will do new content non-stop , plus global population would be much higher.
      2. Compare PvP activity , how it was before and how it is now.
      3. If PvP activity will be the same (In SRD) , or higher - keep this change. If it will be lower - cancel this change.

      Also i want to add - make 4-5 min timer, 1 min is too low.
      Do you suggest canceling the innovation when decreasing pvp in SRD? You're just a genius ... 4-5 minutes is too short time, 20-25 will be just right.

      genius...