Guardian Helms Needs Revamp

    • ViniColen wrote:

      Dismadeus wrote:

      guardian helmet is pretty solid but it competes for the slot against a couple of other really strong items.

      this game is rock paper scissors, some of my builds i dont care if they have a guardian helm, im more worried about killing myself from a reflect if i dont purge in time.

      other builds of mine it counters, because it can clear debuffs. looking at you infernal staff...

      as others have said it is in a strong but good place.

      i also see a lot more hunter hoods than guardian helms these days.
      For me, this means that the game is completly unbalanced.
      Unfortanetely, some skills unviable 100% some weapons. When this happens, opponent dont have a chance against you.
      Break an "E" easily is OP. This happens with purge against whispering bow, for example. But, same time, forge hammers has immunity to purge. Why?
      The fact you can win easily an 1h curse with that helmet, turns that helmet broken for that situation. And in my opinion, as player, we should chase broken things and fix it.
      Albion would be much more enjoyable if we have things 100% balanced.

      "guardian helmet is pretty solid but it competes for the slot against a couple of other really strong items."
      It makes no sense. Helmet slot competes with every helmet at same time, and Guardian helm is good enough to be chosen(and broken for that situation). It is broken if you use something that can win for sure a battle against other weapon.
      You just see the surface..

      The current meta at good players is ..inspect..swap..counter build..profit

      If you play e.g. normal bow you are strong vs noobs, but a lame duck vs mage robe / fin chowl build

      If u play 1 h curse and enemy switches guardian helmet you have to win twice

      Good players not count on luck but cheat luck and have all the swap with you

      SBI has yet to do a statement if their vision of the game is a .. inspect..run..counter..comeback..or if they want skill based play..not counter build based
    • ViniColen wrote:

      Dismadeus wrote:

      guardian helmet is pretty solid but it competes for the slot against a couple of other really strong items.

      this game is rock paper scissors, some of my builds i dont care if they have a guardian helm, im more worried about killing myself from a reflect if i dont purge in time.

      other builds of mine it counters, because it can clear debuffs. looking at you infernal staff...

      as others have said it is in a strong but good place.

      i also see a lot more hunter hoods than guardian helms these days.
      For me, this means that the game is completly unbalanced.
      Unfortanetely, some skills unviable 100% some weapons. When this happens, opponent dont have a chance against you.
      Break an "E" easily is OP. This happens with purge against whispering bow, for example. But, same time, forge hammers has immunity to purge. Why?
      The fact you can win easily an 1h curse with that helmet, turns that helmet broken for that situation. And in my opinion, as player, we should chase broken things and fix it.
      Albion would be much more enjoyable if we have things 100% balanced.

      "guardian helmet is pretty solid but it competes for the slot against a couple of other really strong items."
      It makes no sense. Helmet slot competes with every helmet at same time, and Guardian helm is good enough to be chosen(and broken for that situation). It is broken if you use something that can win for sure a battle against other weapon.
      rock paper scissor balancing is balancing though, regardless of your personal opinion.

      its not perfect, but no game is perfectly balanced unless you want to play like chess all day.

      some things can and cant be purged for balances sake.....

      you cant reflect curse staff E? when you can reflect to many other abilities, why not?

      because it would be too easy to time and reflect, giving reflects and unfair advantage in this setup.

      guardian helm has double the cooldown of cursed staffs E btw, you cant stop every single E.

      cleric robes and assassin shoes can also prevent a curse E, both real cheap.

      in the end the game isnt really balanced for 1v1, and we will see what comes of the new 1v1 gates and balance changes to come.

      if any helms gunna be put on the nerf bat pedestal atm its hunter hood, not guardian helm. a well played guardian helm heals you and clears some debuffs, a well played hunter hood ( at ANY tier/quality ) will just straight up kill you.
      generic signature
    • No man.. You cant reflect curse staff E because you would win easilly a curse with that..
      "its not perfect, but no game is perfectly balanced unless you want to play like chess all day." Of course no game is perfectly balanced. But we need to chase that perfection.
      Better play chess than rock paper scissor. More skill/strategy, less luck.
      But ok, you opinion against my opinion. We cant simply deny unbalanced things.
    • ViniColen wrote:

      No man.. You cant reflect curse staff E because you would win easilly a curse with that..
      "its not perfect, but no game is perfectly balanced unless you want to play like chess all day." Of course no game is perfectly balanced. But we need to chase that perfection.
      Better play chess than rock paper scissor. More skill/strategy, less luck.
      But ok, you opinion against my opinion. We cant simply deny unbalanced things.
      guardian helm is balanced bruh i dont know what else to tell you, just like not being able to not reflect curse staff E is also balanced.

      there is a myriad of other things that also counter curse, like lifetouch staff E, another very strong and popular weapon, in fact its likely the reason you dont see many curses in 2v2 hgs!

      maybe you should learn to play curse better? you want more skill/strategy and your playing 1h curse, arguably one of the most braindead low skill/1 strategy weapons in the game. for every 1 guardian helm cast, you get 2 e casts, unlike lifetouch guardian helmet can not stop every single e you cast as curse. L2P i guess
      generic signature
    • Dismadeus wrote:

      ViniColen wrote:

      No man.. You cant reflect curse staff E because you would win easilly a curse with that..
      "its not perfect, but no game is perfectly balanced unless you want to play like chess all day." Of course no game is perfectly balanced. But we need to chase that perfection.
      Better play chess than rock paper scissor. More skill/strategy, less luck.
      But ok, you opinion against my opinion. We cant simply deny unbalanced things.
      guardian helm is balanced bruh i dont know what else to tell you, just like not being able to not reflect curse staff E is also balanced.
      there is a myriad of other things that also counter curse, like lifetouch staff E, another very strong and popular weapon, in fact its likely the reason you dont see many curses in 2v2 hgs!

      maybe you should learn to play curse better? you want more skill/strategy and your playing 1h curse, arguably one of the most braindead low skill/1 strategy weapons in the game. for every 1 guardian helm cast, you get 2 e casts, unlike lifetouch guardian helmet can not stop every single e you cast as curse. L2P i guess
      I dont said guardian helm is unbalanced. I said guardian helm is broken, against curse. Its what this thread says.
      This is why some "E" cant be reflected, or purged.
    • Dismadeus wrote:

      ViniColen wrote:

      No man.. You cant reflect curse staff E because you would win easilly a curse with that..
      "its not perfect, but no game is perfectly balanced unless you want to play like chess all day." Of course no game is perfectly balanced. But we need to chase that perfection.
      Better play chess than rock paper scissor. More skill/strategy, less luck.
      But ok, you opinion against my opinion. We cant simply deny unbalanced things.
      guardian helm is balanced bruh i dont know what else to tell you, just like not being able to not reflect curse staff E is also balanced.
      there is a myriad of other things that also counter curse, like lifetouch staff E, another very strong and popular weapon, in fact its likely the reason you dont see many curses in 2v2 hgs!

      maybe you should learn to play curse better? you want more skill/strategy and your playing 1h curse, arguably one of the most braindead low skill/1 strategy weapons in the game. for every 1 guardian helm cast, you get 2 e casts, unlike lifetouch guardian helmet can not stop every single e you cast as curse. L2P i guess
      You right, bro. People talks about táctics, chess and broken things when curse staff is one of them most "click, click, win" weapons with 1h daggers.

      Guardián helmet is perfectly balances having twice CD than curse staff E.
    • Idebenn wrote:

      Once again, there are 6 curse staves and people are only talking about one. The helmet unfairly punishes all the other staves when they're either bad or mediocre to begin with.
      any ability that clears debuffs is powerful yes.

      like , lifetouch E, fallen E, arcane W, guard helm etc etc. especially lifetouch, my god thats an amazingly strong weapon right now.

      this is because the debuffs you clear from you are equally powerful.

      what you ask is no counterplay. you can clear light crossbow E with debuff clearing, dont see lcbows not being really good still..

      people need to learn there is no take all comers and do well build, there will always be items your setup loses to. this doesnt make what you lose to overpowered, it means you got countered.
      generic signature
    • But to rehash the 1h curse already has counters available in EVERY armor slot that existed before the guardian helm. Helmet wise you can use soldier helm or merc helm, armor you got cleric robe which is easily triggered by curse stacks, and shoe you have assassin/royal dodge roll shoes.

      Additionally the guardian helm was actually introduced when infernal staff was meta and the side consequences was damaging to all curse lines. Devs seemed to be worried about the incremental DoT damage caused by axe/fire being to strong and forget that an entire line completely depends on DoTs for any damage.

      However with all that said I think most curses would be ok with a compromise of removing the AoE aspect and possibility a slight CD increase for balance.
    • Tabor wrote:

      But to rehash the 1h curse already has counters available in EVERY armor slot that existed before the guardian helm. Helmet wise you can use soldier helm or merc helm, armor you got cleric robe which is easily triggered by curse stacks, and shoe you have assassin/royal dodge roll shoes.

      Additionally the guardian helm was actually introduced when infernal staff was meta and the side consequences was damaging to all curse lines. Devs seemed to be worried about the incremental DoT damage caused by axe/fire being to strong and forget that an entire line completely depends on DoTs for any damage.

      However with all that said I think most curses would be ok with a compromise of removing the AoE aspect and possibility a slight CD increase for balance.
      devs are worried about high dot damage and that being powerful because how how little skill it actually takes to play a dot based class.

      all your suggestions to counter 1h curse work yeah you are right 100%, i use assassin shoes dodge roll myself to get out of so many hairy situations. they dont clear debuffs though and thats a different story.

      weapons that stack debuffs on people are vulnerable debuff cleansing, just like weapons that stack buffs on themselves are vulnerable to a purge, just like weapons that kite are vulnerable to strong cc, just like high damage builds are countered by reflects, etc etc etc etc

      its called balance, and with how easy cursed is to play and just insta pop a person from 50%+ health with a braindead gameplay style, there needs to be readily available just as braindead coutnerplay. ( same goes for infernal, close to 400/400 in fire and that things just boring to play, press E, hope they dont clear it, doesnt take any skill at all..... )

      edit: saw you doign 2v2s near arthurs rest the other day tabor! just came out of my HG when you went in, tried to say hi but i think i was still stealthed.
      generic signature
    • Dismadeus wrote:

      Idebenn wrote:

      Once again, there are 6 curse staves and people are only talking about one. The helmet unfairly punishes all the other staves when they're either bad or mediocre to begin with.
      any ability that clears debuffs is powerful yes.
      like , lifetouch E, fallen E, arcane W, guard helm etc etc. especially lifetouch, my god thats an amazingly strong weapon right now.

      this is because the debuffs you clear from you are equally powerful.

      what you ask is no counterplay. you can clear light crossbow E with debuff clearing, dont see lcbows not being really good still..

      people need to learn there is no take all comers and do well build, there will always be items your setup loses to. this doesnt make what you lose to overpowered, it means you got countered.
      Curse staff relies entirely on the DoTs to deal any actual damage. Unlike light crossbow and whatever else weapon which has an additional DoT skill bundled in while still having direct damage abilities.

      DoTs are the least thing to worry about when there are so many builds that can burst you down from full HP before Vile Curse even gets to tick once.
    • Idebenn wrote:

      Dismadeus wrote:

      Idebenn wrote:

      Once again, there are 6 curse staves and people are only talking about one. The helmet unfairly punishes all the other staves when they're either bad or mediocre to begin with.
      any ability that clears debuffs is powerful yes.like , lifetouch E, fallen E, arcane W, guard helm etc etc. especially lifetouch, my god thats an amazingly strong weapon right now.

      this is because the debuffs you clear from you are equally powerful.

      what you ask is no counterplay. you can clear light crossbow E with debuff clearing, dont see lcbows not being really good still..

      people need to learn there is no take all comers and do well build, there will always be items your setup loses to. this doesnt make what you lose to overpowered, it means you got countered.
      Curse staff relies entirely on the DoTs to deal any actual damage. Unlike light crossbow and whatever else weapon which has an additional DoT skill bundled in while still having direct damage abilities.
      DoTs are the least thing to worry about when there are so many builds that can burst you down from full HP before Vile Curse even gets to tick once.
      guardian helm does not clear damage over time effects though. it says right on it.
      generic signature
    • Dismadeus wrote:

      Idebenn wrote:

      Dismadeus wrote:

      Idebenn wrote:

      Once again, there are 6 curse staves and people are only talking about one. The helmet unfairly punishes all the other staves when they're either bad or mediocre to begin with.
      any ability that clears debuffs is powerful yes.like , lifetouch E, fallen E, arcane W, guard helm etc etc. especially lifetouch, my god thats an amazingly strong weapon right now.
      this is because the debuffs you clear from you are equally powerful.

      what you ask is no counterplay. you can clear light crossbow E with debuff clearing, dont see lcbows not being really good still..

      people need to learn there is no take all comers and do well build, there will always be items your setup loses to. this doesnt make what you lose to overpowered, it means you got countered.
      Curse staff relies entirely on the DoTs to deal any actual damage. Unlike light crossbow and whatever else weapon which has an additional DoT skill bundled in while still having direct damage abilities.DoTs are the least thing to worry about when there are so many builds that can burst you down from full HP before Vile Curse even gets to tick once.
      guardian helm does not clear damage over time effects though. it says right on it.

      Sadly you miss read it, to be honest, it clearly states :"Instantly heals 10% of max health and removes any damage over time effects for you and up to 4 allies in a 4m radius"

      AKA it only cleanses poisons, cultist cowls, mage cowls, burns, curses dots (which takes at most 4 sec to stack up to 4 again on 1 target) and bleeds.
      It doesn't cleanses xbow bomb nor the curse bomb.
      Images
      • Capture.PNG

        191.44 kB, 510×348, viewed 9 times
    • Owlsane wrote:

      Deathskills wrote:

      It doesn't cleanses xbow bomb ...
      Yes it does cleanses xbow bomb (i assume you talk about 1h xbow). You got baited by SBI's tooltip info.
      fair enough on that one, actually makes no sense but aight xD I got trolled hard by that tooltip. Point remains though, the tooltips clearly says it cleanses dots xD
      Never actually had to cleanse a bomb with that helm in the pass tbf. Learning something new everyday!
    • Deathskills wrote:

      Owlsane wrote:

      Deathskills wrote:

      It doesn't cleanses xbow bomb ...
      Yes it does cleanses xbow bomb (i assume you talk about 1h xbow). You got baited by SBI's tooltip info.
      fair enough on that one, actually makes no sense but aight xD I got trolled hard by that tooltip. Point remains though, the tooltips clearly says it cleanses dots xDNever actually had to cleanse a bomb with that helm in the pass tbf. Learning something new everyday!
      hah your right, it does, im too used to my lifetouch E. same idea , clear the dots before it goes boom, or clear the boom before it goes boom.

      still doesnt change the fact its on double the cd of curse staff E though. perhaps curse players could time abilities rather than faceroll keyboards to circumvent having the e dmg mitigated?

      best suggestion ive seen yet, is remove the aoe component and leave the rest as is. prevents stacking and encourages more use of other aoe clears available in game.

      edit: as of this mornings stream, the 1v1 meta will be looked into more to try and make it less of a counter vrs counter setup, and have skilled play matter more. exciting times to be alive as a mostly solo player!
      generic signature

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Dismadeus ().

    • This is my last attempt on this and I will now concede! The only thing that needs to be balanced on this helm is the heal. Most people use the helm for the heal and get the side benefits of fucking DoT classes without even trying for that purpose. Since DoTs do need a counter perhaps remove the heal from this helm entirely and add some type of temporary resist buff. So new ability would be remove DoTs and 6 seconds of magic/physical resistance. This way people would need to actively choose having a defensive for DoTs. Maybe move the heal over to soldier helm since that thing gets 0 play.