Guardian Helms Needs Revamp

    • I agree 100% obviously that guardian helm is a great counter to 1h curse (also yes I may be potentially slight biased being I main 1h curse) but so several other things already exist for this as well that block the power of the build (which is the E). I am fine with all these counters such as cleric robe, dodge roll boots, etc because if those are timed well they block a powerful E (the 1h bomb). However guardian helm operates differently it instead removes all the stacks that take time for curse to apply and then on top of that provides a substantial heal. That is the only reason I talk about guardian helm it just has to much power in one package IMO. I can still beat guardian helms on a regular basis I am not trying to imply they are unbeatable. It just has a lot for a base helm slot.
    • I am playing everything, I have like every shit 400, and I tell you, guardian helmet is too much

      I am 400 curse and 400 holy and 400 nature and 400 xbow and 400 bow and 400 sword....... list goes on but not relevant

      I don't do this to not brag but to tell you, I am neutral

      I would do one thing as a start

      Guardian helmet does "true heal" means it does 10%0total health - full stop, no modifier from gear..

      And then we should see what happens and if this is enough
    • Neef wrote:

      Tabor just because you pretty much only play 1 handed curse doesn't mean you should go after every item that counters your build xD From looking at your killboard you do just fine with guarden helm the way it is, And yes i am saying you have a good killboard.

      I am going to bite and answer. IF something is indeed unbalanced (I honestly can't tell), why would it matter who calls it out? :D. Like would someone who mains Guardian Helmet or Pike admitting to it being broken, change how balanced it is? Shouldn't we be discussing on what you can do or can't do against it instead?
    • Tabor wrote:

      This has been discussed in previous threads but I think it needs to have more attention. The curse class completely depends on slow ramp up damage by stacking DoTs and you allowed this helm in game than just instantly makes curse irrelevant. How does it make any sense to allow a defensive that completely removes 10 seconds worth of work stacking DoTs and cause the curse class to start over again? This is beyond a disadvantage in small scale PvP. Defensive's from what I can tell were meant for well timed ability mitigation while the guardian helm is actually a complete easy mode class destroyer. There should be nothing in the game that removes DoTs. Us curse players try to find ways around it but this item basically makes us take fights with one arm tied behind our backs. Please consider removing to the DoT cleanse from the guardian helm. @Retroman
      So whats your point?
      You complain about disadvantage in small scale PvP.
      In small scale removing the dot-remove should change nothing at all.
      Because small scale means, to me at least, 1+ vs 1+
      People will adept and go for Cleric Cowl, or go for dedicated healer (if they dont have one already) AND swap to cleric cowl.

      And you have to time the guardian helmet too, its not like you get an immunity to dots...

      For me all you say sounds like: Guardian helmet is the only counter for your easy 1vs1 build and thats why it is bad. And in 1vs1 you always have some counter to your gear. Thats how is should be.

      In small scale, you have to adept your playstyle, unless all of you run with 1h cursed and all your enemies have guardian helmet, what i cant believe.
      Coordinate who get the E, zone ppl with guardian helmets, whatever.

      Few friends of mine run small scale with one of them beeing 1h cursed all the time and guardian helmet change nothing. (most of the time, only when he is trying to chase a guy with that helm alone maybe)

      If they remove the dot-remove on guardian helmet i like to see some kind of (small scale) usefull spell on healers to clean dots.
      The only two heal abilities that come to my mind are are the E from Fallen Staff (cast time and delayed execution, needs lot of coordination) and the E from Lifetouch Staff (6m range channel)
    • Increase the heal from guardian helmet to 15% - but make it a "true heal" like lifesteal basically (lifesteal from weapons passive or Hellion jacket does not cause healing sickness) or make it like "Levitate" on Cultist robe - its a flat HP % regain that is not affected by healing increase I believe.

      keep the DOT removal.

      That way 3k HP tanks actually heal for 450 HP (this was never an issue TBH, and ironically tanks never run this) - how it was meant

      2.5k HP clothies heal for 300 HP (a nerf to current number) - how it was meant.

      Right now we have 3000 HP tanks healing for 300 (because they dont have any healing bonus) and clothies with 2.5k HP healing for 450+ because they have healing bonus. Makes no sense.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Captainrussia ().

    • Owlsane wrote:

      Captainrussia wrote:

      or make it like "Levitate" on Cultist robe - its a flat HP % regain that is not affected by healing increase I believe.
      I've just tested right know as i had a doubt about it and i confrim that healing cast bonus does apply to the cultist robe
      thanks.

      Well in that case - make it like "Levitate, but without healing bonus" - i.e a flat amount.
    • Dude,

      You are crying about specific items countering specific items.
      You must understand, the game is meant to be that way. Different builds counter different builds.
      Guardian helmet removes DoT - Only thing which it fully counters is Curse staff.
      Axes bleed's are easy to be stacked, and they are not enhancing the E's.

      Cleric robe has such a big CD, that it cannot really effectively counter the curse.
      Assassin boots - sacrificing huge mobility, just to counter your E?

      Bruh, you can't expect to have one build which dominates everything.
      That's what you are asking for.


      Learn, adapt. Change your build, if you run into too many guardian helmets, as many others have before.
    • Satyrns you do understand the curse is a slow build stack damage class correct? You also do realize that you cannot really kite effectively while stacking since the Q range is so little right? Small scale fighting (solo or 2s) the sickle Q is garbage so you still need to use the close combat vile Q. So the trade off of playing curse originally was you had to take damage and use defensive's while you 4 stacked your opponent because at 4 stacks your damage is finally kicking into gear. With guardian helm it has made curse need to blow the majority of defensive's only for our opponent to simply go "oh I now have 4 stacks let me push D real quick and remove ALL of those stack AND get healed up all the damage I took while getting those 4 stacks), So essentially as curse I now have to start all over down all my defensive as a squishy player and still need to play close range to reapply all of them again. You cannot have a class completely depended on stacking to be effective and also add a defensive that removes stacks. It really just makes no sense. That is more than a counter it is a entire class killer.
    • @Tabor

      I understand you, completly!
      But what i'm saying is, that you want to fix the guardian helmet, just because it's affecting your build (Your build is weak against it). Think about this, without the guardian helmet, i would stand no chance against 1h curse - just because it's so strong. So i would ask to nerf it aswell?That doesn't make sense.
      Try to fight 1v1 against 1handed curse staff, which has mercenary jacket, let's say, with just cleric robe.


      You are looking into 1v1, 2v2s, which i agree, curse is not the best, because of the guardian helmet, and how popular it is.
      But in bigger fights, great curse is still pretty strong, as DoT does quite some damage, and it's difficult to heal 5 people, when they have curse stacks.

      In general, what i'm saying is, that you must look it in a bigger picture, how many builds does guardian helmet counters? Axes, Fire staffs - medium counter - Removes DoT, and heavy counter for Curses
      There are alot of builds, which counter each other, and the game is supposed to be like that. It's pretty much rock, paper, scissors - You can't expect to play just Rock and scissors, else, there's no point to choose the scissors.
    • @Retroman consider removing the combination of heal AND full DoT removal of guardian helm. It should just be one or the other. Right now the vast majority of solo and small scale OW players run guardian helm purely for the heal and get the benefit of fucking curse at the same time. It allows them to avoid needing to run something in their kit to block bomb which is why you see items like soldier helm and assassin shoes all but extinct atm.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Tabor ().

    • Tabor wrote:

      @Retroman consider removing the combination of heal AND full DoT removal of guardian helm. It should just be one or the other. Right now the vast majority of solo and small scale OW players run guardian helm purely for the heal and get the benefit of fucking curse at the same time. It allows them to avoid needing to run something in their kit to block bomb which is why you see items like soldier helm and assassin shoes all but extinct atm.
      Still trying to remove the only form of removing dots I see.
    • The issue is bigger, it is in fact the best head piece for mage robe... Cause of heal boost..

      It would not be such an issue, if it not best headpiece budget for FF..

      So basically, the immune curse is a side effect for heaving the best budget solo FF headpiece for mage robe..

      So ..all people have as collateral damage the 100% counter to curse as side effect, that's why u frustrated .

      From a meta view, there is diversity..Merc helm knight helm soldier helm in ZvZ.. cleric c in 2 hg ..and guardian in SRD..

      Out of pure numbers.. it is all good..but collateral damage, curse suffers the issue of a lot of weapons..not good for solo play
    • I feel like curse being countered by guardian helm is an unfortunate side-effect and one that's difficult to balance.

      On the other hand, the fact that guardian helm is being run as a default helmet on all builds/classes as a heal (regardless of its effect against curse) is a general issue that should be addressed first. In that sense I think if you limit it in a way that affects rats mostly, the problem would mostly go away. Limit the cleric/cloth robe interaction and lower/remove the AoE seems pretty reasonable?
    • Just make vile curse non removable... there problem fixed. Removing bleeds is ok in my book.

      Or make vile curse do 50% (or other percentage of full duration if dispelled). Or make target silenced if they remove 3 or more stacks of vile-curse. WoW has some nice counters for purges for warlocks.

      Purge skills should be complementary to a build and not counter a weapon mechanic totally. Weapon skills should always have priority over sustain. Armor should allow you a small window to survive not give you complete immunity versus a weapon line.
    • The problem with the Guardian Helmet is his 30sec CD, if it was 40 or 45, it would be more balanced. Tomb guard helm, for example, has 50 seconds of CD, which makes the guard helmet very strong, is to use kite and CD compositions, being able to claim healing every 25 ~~ 23 seconds. If you remove the purification from that helmet, it will be impossible to stop the Cursed with 1 hand.