Disarray (Zerg Debuff)

    • stop complain ! that is why is called zerg, if you cant get enought ppl dont fight against huge blobs that yours. It is stupid to make player make zvz only with 20 ppl. This will kill new players that wanna join in zvz, becouse every guild will select best 20-30. Zergs are good. Little reduce dmg of huge zerg it is enoguht. No need to nerf the game too much. Stop make game too easy. It is nice to one shot ppl who doesnt have good equipment or highs specs. If you make everyone to survive more in battle players that have high specs are fucked again. PLEASE stop make this game easy with every single patch. thanks
    • Sas3bg wrote:

      stop complain ! that is why is called zerg, if you cant get enought ppl dont fight against huge blobs that yours. It is stupid to make player make zvz only with 20 ppl. This will kill new players that wanna join in zvz, becouse every guild will select best 20-30. Zergs are good. Little reduce dmg of huge zerg it is enoguht. No need to nerf the game too much. Stop make game too easy. It is nice to one shot ppl who doesnt have good equipment or highs specs. If you make everyone to survive more in battle players that have high specs are fucked again. PLEASE stop make this game easy with every single patch. thanks
      in other words, if you don't have enough people to zone Cap, don't show
    • Hollywoodi wrote:

      Sas3bg wrote:

      stop complain ! that is why is called zerg, if you cant get enought ppl dont fight against huge blobs that yours. It is stupid to make player make zvz only with 20 ppl. This will kill new players that wanna join in zvz, becouse every guild will select best 20-30. Zergs are good. Little reduce dmg of huge zerg it is enoguht. No need to nerf the game too much. Stop make game too easy. It is nice to one shot ppl who doesnt have good equipment or highs specs. If you make everyone to survive more in battle players that have high specs are fucked again. PLEASE stop make this game easy with every single patch. thanks
      in other words, if you don't have enough people to zone Cap, don't show
      He's just trying to say if they can't bring twice as many numbers they can't win.

      In all reality, we're trying to bring down the scale to fight on more even grounds due to groups feeling the need to bring T4/5 blobs against T2/3.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by MMOLIFE: Grammar correction ().

    • Thanks everyone for your feedback

      After the first big fights we observed two main problems with the current iteration:
      • The relative debuff difference is not very high between big groups, because they are all close to the 25% cap.
      • Having two big groups fight both with a highly stacked debuff changes the combat meta quiet a bit.


      To improve this, we will rework the debuff and the stats in the following way:
      • The Debuff starts at 25 players
      • every 5 additional players the bonus defense vs players is reduced by 1%, while also reducing the bonus damage by the same effective value
      • So, if two zergs of the same size fight each other, the damage and defense reduction should cancel each other out.
      • Fighting mobs is not affected


      Values:

      Player Threshholdbonusdefensevsplayersbonusdamagevsplayers
      25-0.01-0.01
      30-0.02-0.02
      35-0.03-0.03
      40-0.04-0.04
      45-0.05-0.05
      50-0.06-0.06
      55-0.07-0.08
      60-0.08-0.09
      65-0.09-0.10
      70-0.10-0.11
      75-0.11-0.12
      80-0.12-0.14
      85-0.13-0.15
      90-0.14-0.16
      95-0.15-0.18
      100-0.16-0.19
      105-0.17-0.20
      110-0.18-0.22
      115-0.19-0.23
      120-0.20-0.25
      125-0.21-0.27
      130-0.22-0.28
      135-0.23-0.30
      140-0.24-0.32
      145-0.25-0.33
      150-0.26-0.35
      155-0.27-0.37
      160-0.28-0.39
      165-0.29-0.41
      170-0.30-0.43
      175-0.31-0.45
      180-0.32-0.47
      185-0.33-0.49
      190-0.34-0.52
      195-0.35-0.54
      200-0.36-0.56
      205-0.37-0.59
      210-0.38-0.61
      215-0.39-0.64
      220-0.40-0.67
      225-0.41-0.69
      230-0.42-0.72
      235-0.43-0.75
      240-0.44-0.79
      245-0.45-0.82
      250-0.46-0.85
      255-0.47-0.89



      Cheers,
      Retro

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Retroman ().

    • @Retroman you literally messed up the game meta with the latest change. I already warned devs not to reduce defense. Now the big guilds/alliances are creating 2-4 alliances to avoid these debuffs and they're also paying people with max spec. Now a Gallantines player no in any alliance can come into a zerg and do 5.4k damage to people wearing T8 armors.

      Is this buff saying people just lose .47 resistance at 255 players, or is it 47% ? Because those two numbers make a huge difference. Need some clarity on the table.
      Youtube Tametheark

      The post was edited 1 time, last by yiconomics ().

    • Retroman wrote:

      Thanks everyone for your feedback

      After the first big fights we observed two main problems with the current iteration:
      • The relative debuff difference is not very high between big groups, because they are all close to the 25% cap.
      • Having two big groups fight both with a highly stacked debuff changes the combat meta quiet a bit.


      To improve this, we will rework the debuff and the stats in the following way:
      • The Debuff starts at 25 players
      • every 5 additional players the bonus defense vs players is reduced by 1%, while also reducing the bonus damage by the same effective value
      • So, if two zergs of the same size fight each other, the damage and defense reduction should cancel each other out.
      • Fighting mobs is not affected


      Values:

      Player Threshholdbonusdefensevsplayersbonusdamagevsplayers
      25-0.01-0.01
      30-0.02-0.02
      35-0.03-0.03
      40-0.04-0.04
      45-0.05-0.05
      50-0.06-0.06
      55-0.07-0.08
      60-0.08-0.09
      65-0.09-0.10
      70-0.10-0.11
      75-0.11-0.12
      80-0.12-0.14
      85-0.13-0.15
      90-0.14-0.16
      95-0.15-0.18
      100-0.16-0.19
      105-0.17-0.20
      110-0.18-0.22
      115-0.19-0.23
      120-0.20-0.25
      125-0.21-0.27
      130-0.22-0.28
      135-0.23-0.30
      140-0.24-0.32
      145-0.25-0.33
      150-0.26-0.35
      155-0.27-0.37
      160-0.28-0.39
      165-0.29-0.41
      170-0.30-0.43
      175-0.31-0.45
      180-0.32-0.47
      185-0.33-0.49
      190-0.34-0.52
      195-0.35-0.54
      200-0.36-0.56
      205-0.37-0.59
      210-0.38-0.61
      215-0.39-0.64
      220-0.40-0.67
      225-0.41-0.69
      230-0.42-0.72
      235-0.43-0.75
      240-0.44-0.79
      245-0.45-0.82
      250-0.46-0.85
      255-0.47-0.89


      Cheers,
      Retro
      I think you are just digging even further down the hole and making the problem worse by adding more variables to it.

      Albion just has too many PvP systems stacked, you need to cut it down, not add more complexity.

      All you will do is change the meta and force bomb squads to drop ally before clapping, but nothing will really change, zerging is still the best solution... even if the bomb squads can't drop more players will always be better, all you are doing is creating elitism and toxicity towards new players.

      Stop messing around, stop making albion more complicated than it needs to be... remove all the alliances from the game, comment out the "create alliance" code and just let us fight the rest of the season allianceless, let's test how it goes before the new BZ comes out... if it sucks you just revert the change and put alliances back in the game.

      You guys will have a completely reworked BZ but it will be unenjoyable because the zergs and mega alliances will still be a problem... just remove the problem by removing alliances.
    • Devastate wrote:

      Retroman wrote:

      Thanks everyone for your feedback

      After the first big fights we observed two main problems with the current iteration:
      • The relative debuff difference is not very high between big groups, because they are all close to the 25% cap.
      • Having two big groups fight both with a highly stacked debuff changes the combat meta quiet a bit.


      To improve this, we will rework the debuff and the stats in the following way:
      • The Debuff starts at 25 players
      • every 5 additional players the bonus defense vs players is reduced by 1%, while also reducing the bonus damage by the same effective value
      • So, if two zergs of the same size fight each other, the damage and defense reduction should cancel each other out.
      • Fighting mobs is not affected


      Values:

      Player Threshholdbonusdefensevsplayersbonusdamagevsplayers
      25-0.01-0.01
      30-0.02-0.02
      35-0.03-0.03
      40-0.04-0.04
      45-0.05-0.05
      50-0.06-0.06
      55-0.07-0.08
      60-0.08-0.09
      65-0.09-0.10
      70-0.10-0.11
      75-0.11-0.12
      80-0.12-0.14
      85-0.13-0.15
      90-0.14-0.16
      95-0.15-0.18
      100-0.16-0.19
      105-0.17-0.20
      110-0.18-0.22
      115-0.19-0.23
      120-0.20-0.25
      125-0.21-0.27
      130-0.22-0.28
      135-0.23-0.30
      140-0.24-0.32
      145-0.25-0.33
      150-0.26-0.35
      155-0.27-0.37
      160-0.28-0.39
      165-0.29-0.41
      170-0.30-0.43
      175-0.31-0.45
      180-0.32-0.47
      185-0.33-0.49
      190-0.34-0.52
      195-0.35-0.54
      200-0.36-0.56
      205-0.37-0.59
      210-0.38-0.61
      215-0.39-0.64
      220-0.40-0.67
      225-0.41-0.69
      230-0.42-0.72
      235-0.43-0.75
      240-0.44-0.79
      245-0.45-0.82
      250-0.46-0.85
      255-0.47-0.89


      Cheers,
      Retro
      I think you are just digging even further down the hole and making the problem worse by adding more variables to it.
      Albion just has too many PvP systems stacked, you need to cut it down, not add more complexity.

      All you will do is change the meta and force bomb squads to drop ally before clapping, but nothing will really change, zerging is still the best solution... even if the bomb squads can't drop more players will always be better, all you are doing is creating elitism and toxicity towards new players.

      Stop messing around, stop making albion more complicated than it needs to be... remove all the alliances from the game, comment out the "create alliance" code and just let us fight the rest of the season allianceless, let's test how it goes before the new BZ comes out... if it sucks you just revert the change and put alliances back in the game.

      You guys will have a completely reworked BZ but it will be unenjoyable because the zergs and mega alliances will still be a problem... just remove the problem by removing alliances.
      won't happen, faceloss already too big to do the simple solution now...
    • More tweaks to the system is for sure warranted, but this disarray buff was implemented to give smaller groups a chance at fighting bigger ones, yes? Why not just try to normalize group size by limiting or removing alliances as a whole?

      Albion literally cannot handle zerg level performance, it's been an ever-present issue since launch. Give real meaning to GUILDS and break up these fickle 4-10k alliances that have taken the game over. 90% of Albion players don't want to be in a big massive alliances, but they have no choice in the matter if they want to compete at all. Change that, and Albion will prosper.
    • Retroman wrote:

      Thanks everyone for your feedback
      ...
      Everyone suggests you capping alliances or removing them completely, this is what people want, why u guys can't listen to them and at least try removing alliances for a few weeks, just to check how is it working. 1st version of disarray debuff was absurd, not matched into actual zone caps or any tests, now after 2 fights u're changing it by 180 degrees again and will wait how it will work out.

      Trust me, 2 weeks of alliance-less gameplay wouldnt be worse than messing up with this debuff.
    • The biggest problem remains in the leader of alliances itself.

      Take squad as example, they split they alliance in two, and even make "sex with ex" play outside the alliance, just to avoid the zerg debuff.

      And when the smart cluster comes out this will make them have more players in the zone, they can't win a fair ZvZ, them they bring more to just step on you like a herd.

      You can say that they pay a price for this, the risk of being friendly fired, but is super simple just to send one alliance around and flank, or just hold a position on a castle, being friendly fired is extremely hard.

      Nothing we can do in the fight trough, we can just dive in they zerg and stay there until one side die, without playing smart at all, and if we win, the other side can simply come and kill everyone that's left.
    • F0XXX wrote:

      The biggest problem remains in the leader of alliances itself.

      Take squad as example, they split they alliance in two, and even make "sex with ex" play outside the alliance, just to avoid the zerg debuff.

      And when the smart cluster comes out this will make them have more players in the zone, they can't win a fair ZvZ, them they bring more to just step on you like a herd.

      You can say that they pay a price for this, the risk of being friendly fired, but is super simple just to send one alliance around and flank, or just hold a position on a castle, being friendly fired is extremely hard.

      Nothing we can do in the fight trough, we can just dive in they zerg and stay there until one side die, without playing smart at all, and if we win, the other side can simply come and kill everyone that's left.
      Maybe then increase the cooldown for join an alliance to two weeks if there are people abusing the mechanics. Being separated from your alliance without receiving an invitation for two weeks is enough time for dramas.