[UPDATED 4.10.2019 15:54UTC] Silver Sink Adjustments Coming Soon

    • Balushaev wrote:

      Actual feedback, DEVS PLEASE NOTICE.

      Lots of silver is generated from skipping dungeons / HGs. You can nerf these ways of earning silver to solve some problems. It is kinda obvious. For example you can make dungeon chests lootable if only ALL mobs before the chest are dead. You can also make HG chest lootable only if ALL mobs and bosses in HG are dead (same for boss in 5x5 HGs). This will nerf the speed of gaining silver in PVE, which is incredibly fast now. You can actually earn enough silver for a monthly premium just by skipping random dungeons and ONLY killing mobs near chests (and looting those chests) for 1 evening. Healing sickness did not solve that problem, healers can still easily skip through dungeons.

      ps - maybe even remove chests and add a little bit of loot to actual mobs and bosses.
      pps - you can also make a bigger % of items trashed, when a player dies. This will also sink lots of silver.

      @Eltharyon @Korn
      Yes!
      Although I don't think the ps or the pps are things that need to happen. Lately I have been thinking that it would be good if either all of the mobs need to be killed or at least a good random, but very high, percentage of them. It gets old fighting through dungeons only to find no boss or chest at the end...

      There are times when almost everything is trashed and times when not so much is trashed. I think it's good as is. Messing with that could become demoralizing and make ganking FAR less enjoyable. That would be very sensitive... if adjusted to trash too much more, I know I'd probably quit ganking.
    • @Gugusteh True, fair enough , time is everything. But my aim was to point Dev's attention one more time that New Silver Sink mechanic is needed. Let it be later , but it must exist in nearest patches.

      @ARandomPlayer Oh believe me , i know how much money different people have and its value for them. From people who are happy to have 50-100k silver , to people who got 1-3 billions of silver and want more. Further efficient of such players will depend of knowledge , and only this is the main aspect and formula of success of individual gameplay. So when i was typing my feedback - i took into account this too.

      @Roccandil Because sometimes Devs listen to whiners, mostly it is new players , with no clue how this weapon/armor/mechanic works and how to deal with it in game, and the only way to stop it - is type about it , via detailed feedback. Of course if you know about what are you talking about. I do not type in threads and do not making conversations in some game aspects that i have no clue , or got low knowledge. I respect myself and Devs time. That's why my posts are aggressive , sometimes. But i don't give a s*it about tolerance, when we talk about global changes. If you think my post was in "form of bullying" , let it be.

      And about my personal attitude to a new players , do not misunderstood me - i will always help to a new guy with advice ( if he need it ) , in-game currency , tips , feeedbacks , guides etc. I love to help people, but there are some circumstances , when i must have such behavior.

      ----------
      About Gold market questions
      -Do you really think the gold investors will need to sell gold to get more silver?
      -Why should i stay with money in silver?

      Yes, and yes IF there would be more NEW Silver Sinks as a new mechanics , as i posted higher. Mostly it will work for an old players. And new changes will just FORCE you to use this silver , with current incoming changes. It will not affect your gameplay at all , even if you are man who are happy to have 100k silver in your pocket. But will help globally to heal up economy and decrease price on Premium , which in long perspective is much better for everyone , From low tier player to a high tier.

      As result - you will waste ( INDIVIDUALLY ) much less silver in further patch during your game play.

      The post was edited 3 times, last by Equart ().

    • @Eltharyon

      I believe the key to fixing the Gold Inflation would involve creating more incentives for players to purchase gold from the shop, opposed to adding more silver sinks into the game.

      Right now Gold is a limited resource which is being eaten up by many of the new players that have joined Albion and decided to stay. These players are in bulk people who are not really buying gold via the shop so the Gold is simply inflating. Adding silver sinks will make it harder for many of the free 2 play people to buy more gold but it won't actually fix the problem which is Gold being consumed faster then it is replenished.

      Players like myself who have the extra income to invest in gold get along fine since when I need loads of silver I take advantage of the inflated Gold market. I know that there are others out there too who invest in gold but likewise for me personally I don't have to buy gold that often, I have over a year's worth of premium and do moderately well and when I do cash out my gold it gets me a fair bit of silver so I am set for a good while.

      Now what you could do is find ways of getting me to spend money for other things which also generates gold. I recall some people have suggested making it so you could straight up buy the recruiter perks rather then having to recruit players. Example instead of me needing to recruit 5 players to the game to get the sheep dog skin, you let me pay 25 dollars for the skin. It would then also give me x amount of gold. This gold would eventually make its way back into the market.

      Another variation of this though it would likely piss a lot of people off is you make skins or other non pay2win items that people purchase and whenever someone does purchase them a certain percentage of gold is generated and added to the Gold market to help deflate it.

      Here is a list of things I would love to see:
      -House/Building Skins (maybe make them use a special item like the anchor that is also trad-able)
      -Unique Storage Chest skins (ones that can only be used inside a building)
      -Special mounts with abilities (I.E. Pest Lizard) Crafted through a mix in-game found materials & Shop purchased goods.

      SPECIAL MOUNTS Extra Details
      -So the way special mounts like the Pest Lizard would work is first players find the babies for these mounts through some rare drops which every loves. Then once they are grown up you need some special token item to fuse with the adult and create the saddled mount. This token would be obtained in two ways, first way is you would do monthly events like you do now that would reward the player with the token. Maybe some of the tokens could be found from an event chest which randomly chooses a token. The other method is players could pay real money in your shop to get the tokens. If they do pay real money though for the token you then inject an appropriate amount of gold into the market to balance the P2Win aspect.

      I think people could enjoy this system if you do it like I said so there is a chance to get the ingredients by being purely a free player or someone who spends some money. Also I am not saying to do this with the pest lizard itself, I think you should create some new mounts we haven't seen yet. The great thing about them is that these mounts we will see being used in the open world since they wont be super rare and at the same time players will enjoy that chance to kill players on them and steal the mounts for themselves which was part of the gripe people had with the skins. (I do love my tiger skin though :)

      Anyways thank you Robin as well as all the other people who work hard on making Albion Online better each day. I know you guys really do care even though people can dish out so a fair bit of negativity. Wish you the best.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by DoomRawrus ().

    • Hey there,

      thanks for all the feedback.

      A more general point: some of you have said that the planned changes will affect new players too strongly. We do not think that's the case, for the following reasons:
      • The biggest in-game expense for new players by far is the premium status. Measured in silver, at the price of almost 4400 silver per Gold that we saw before we announced the planned changes, that is 11m silver per month. Right now, purely as a result of the announcement of the planned changes, the gold price has dropped as low as 3600 - the difference for 1 months of premium here is equal to 2 million silver. Actual prices are always in flux, but it is extremely clear that the silver values we are talking about here are far more significant than the increase in repair costs or island upgrades, which are a one time expense. We don't know what the price of Gold will become once the changes actually go live, but there is a significant chance that they will go below the 3600 level that we have already seen.
      • For "rich" players, on the other hand, the monthly premium cost is not such a big factor. If, say, you earn 100m silver per month, it is not that relevant whether you pay 11m or 8m for your premium status. However, scaling sinks such as market fees/taxes, silver generated by the black market or optional sinks such as respec or transmutation can matter a great deal. And what will also matter is the impact the changes have or already had on gold savings.
      Having said that, one of the reasons that we posted the planned changes ahead of time was to collect feedback from the community, allowing us to fine tune them before they go live.
    • @Korn, Thank you for caring and for listening to your player base

      I think you are going about it in the wrong way even though I agree with your goal. Your problem is that you have a very uneven population with great income disparity. You have old players with hundreds of millions of silver (in silver or gold) and then you have a lot of relatively new players struggling with the economy and leveling up at the same time. For quite a while you had a decline in population and then you went F2P, which gave a large boost to the population, but it also means that you have very few "middle class citizens" in between.

      The following are measures I think would make more sense to fix the income disparity and make it easier for new players to thrive (enjoying the game instead of spending most of their online time on chasing premium):

      1) Make Premium the only thing that can be purchased with gold. You have F2P players buying gold for their premium and then suddenly the gold price spikes because rich players suddenly need to buy a lot of gold to buy a new skin or mount. It does not remove fluctuations from speculation in gold, but you will not have rich players competing with poor players for gold every time you bring out a new skin or mount.

      2) Introduce a tradeable Progression Token that is the only way to buy vanity items. Every time you gain a 10th level in something, you get a Progression Token, but maximum 3 tokens per day. If a new mount costs, say 300 tokens, then a player can decide to wait 100 days or to buy the tokens on the AH. This is primarily a redistribution mechanic, that gives newer players something very valuable to sell to rich players. The tokens come from nothing, shift silver, and disappear when a vanity item is bought.
      In addition to making it easier for new players to make money it also increases the supply of gold (and drives prices down) as gold hoarders have a reason to sell off some of their gold and "instant gratification kids" with deep pockes will add to the supply of gold when they buy it for RL money to sell for silver in order to buy tokens to get a fancy mount or skin.

      3) Shut down the Black Market in Caerleon. The concept of buying crafted gear to use as drops is brilliant, but it would be a lot healthier for the economy if the items are bought from all the auction houses in the royal cities. Right now, it is easy to buy premium from BM trading, but lowering the prices 10% only means that you have to sell more items to make the same amount of silver. It is a lame shortcut to making money and, again, it gives a big advantage to rich players.
      This will increase demand at the royal AHs and drive up prices for items. But, it will also drive up prices for materials, which will make gathering more profitable, especially for new players. This also makes it viable for a low level crafter to get into crafting. When starting out as a crafter, it is almost impossible to make a decent profit when competing with the level 100 crafters who dump low level items for peanuts in the royal cities.

      4) Introduce a differentiated tax on selling stuff on the AHs. 3% for a T3 items/mats, 4% for a T4 items/mats etc. This is a silver sink that hits everybody according to the size of their pockets (and the tax will be included in prices anyway). The other day, one of my very rich guild mates mentioned buying a T8 item for 100 million and selling it for 125 million - whether he makes a 23 million profit or "only" 15 million makes little difference; it is still a couple of months of premium he can make with one trade while the rest of us have to spend days or weeks just to earn one month of premium.

      There are many other things that can be tweaked, but I think these initiatives will have the greatest impact on making it easier to thrive as new player. The goal is not to make it easy to buy premium, but to make it easier, so players don't quit because buying premium with in-game currency turns into a pie in the sky that is unattainable.
    • I would go for what i call a "Dynamic" update on taxes, either Weekly or Monthly.

      Those would be done automatically at a given time, and would take into consideration the ammount of silver used for that specific feature.




      For this we would have "base value" and "dynamic value".

      Let's say in one month we had 3 billion silver actively being used in the course of one month in the market, which actually have a 3% tax (1% to set + 2% per sell).

      If, in the next month, the value of silver becomes 6 billion, the month after it should automatically be set to 6% (2% to set + 4% per sell).



      This same mechanic should be used in all other silver generation / sink. Dynamic taxes/ drop rates.

      Less bags in dungeons if too many silver bags were dropped in the last month.

      Less black market orders if too many people is using black market compulsively (this one is huge)



      This would also add value to specific non used PVE options, like normals chests in Static Dungeons / Roaming Mobs Camps, as the Dynamism could also rise the ammount of silver dropped in case some specific feature is underused (Hello, HCE).
    • PenguinSniper wrote:

      Volnay wrote:

      In the middle of their Queen ad campaign they decide to drop a patch of unpopular measures. That sounds weird. Goodbye dear "hype".
      What do they tell us ? Everything's okay on the gold supply front, you players just got it wrong with a gold demand far too high... We removed the game packs with their embedded gold, never counterbalanced by the gold packages. We even introduced cosmetics to further decrease the gold volume persistence on the market in order to aggravate the situation but the real problem is that you extract too much silver from our game!
      Well let's decrease the silver injected into the game, uuuh no let's tax the active players instead. Yeah more taxes, always a nice step towards ptp or ptw.
      However the real masterpiece is to overregulate the market. Whilst I was curious about the hypertrophic distribution of materials and artefacts coming with the Oberon release, I am not willing to see a regulation on the resources. This is a kill joy unless you actually like using a spreadsheet as a game substitute.
      Btw dear gatherers I feel you, always more risk and less rewards.

      Do you really want to see the gold rate decreased? Why don't you just try to use real life measures such as a negative interest rate policy with a global threshold?

      Video games are supposed to be fun, there is no fun in what you propose.
      I have not enjoyed playing albion today. Because of this crap.
      Higher repair costs.

      Fml.

      Different game time maybe
      I've already started downloading other mmos now.. and some shooters
      *lifts tail* Nya :x
    • Korn wrote:

      Hey there,

      thanks for all the feedback.

      A more general point: some of you have said that the planned changes will affect new players too strongly. We do not think that's the case, for the following reasons:
      • The biggest in-game expense for new players by far is the premium status. Measured in silver, at the price of almost 4400 silver per Gold that we saw before we announced the planned changes, that is 11m silver per month. Right now, purely as a result of the announcement of the planned changes, the gold price has dropped as low as 3600 - the difference for 1 months of premium here is equal to 2 million silver. Actual prices are always in flux, but it is extremely clear that the silver values we are talking about here are far more significant than the increase in repair costs or island upgrades, which are a one time expense. We don't know what the price of Gold will become once the changes actually go live, but there is a significant chance that they will go below the 3600 level that we have already seen.
      • For "rich" players, on the other hand, the monthly premium cost is not such a big factor. If, say, you earn 100m silver per month, it is not that relevant whether you pay 11m or 8m for your premium status. However, scaling sinks such as market fees/taxes, silver generated by the black market or optional sinks such as respec or transmutation can matter a great deal. And what will also matter is the impact the changes have or already had on gold savings.
      Having said that, one of the reasons that we posted the planned changes ahead of time was to collect feedback from the community, allowing us to fine tune them before they go live.
      Or you posted this early to scare the gold market to confirm what we suspect is gonna be cash grabs to come.. This was a great social experiment I see.
      *lifts tail* Nya :x
    • Korn wrote:


      • The biggest in-game expense for new players by far is the premium status. Measured in silver, at the price of almost 4400 silver per Gold that we saw before we announced the planned changes, that is 11m silver per month. Right now, purely as a result of the announcement of the planned changes, the gold price has dropped as low as 3600 - the difference for 1 months of premium here is equal to 2 million silver. Actual prices are always in flux, but it is extremely clear that the silver values we are talking about here are far more significant than the increase in repair costs or island upgrades, which are a one time expense. We don't know what the price of Gold will become once the changes actually go live, but there is a significant chance that they will go below the 3600 level that we have already seen.

      Sure some of this stuff makes sense, the market fees seem like a fairly good way to sink silver out of the economy in a way that will impact the richer players more than newer players. But others really don't make sense if the goal is to lower the burden on newer players...
      • I have multiple already maxxed out islands, increasing island purchase costs overwhelmingly will affect newer players the most. Instead of increasing costs of current islands, higher tiers with higher costs could have been released. Island "perks" could have been released that for a large amount of silver would increase the gathering yield of farm plots by 10%, build a "guild chest" at the entrance to your island, etc... That would make more sense.
      • For players with hundreds of millions of silver, utilizing auto-respec with 100 masteries on gear has a negligible effect on their overall wealth. A newer player hitting 100 in their masteries will likely have to pick between being less efficient in their faming by not using auto-respec, or having to pay a much more significant portion of their wealth to get the same benefits.
      • Newer players are both significantly more likely to go down and much more likely to care about repair costs, versus a player with 100M+ silver. Etc...
      Overall as an "upper middle class" player in this game, I stand to benefit significantly from these changes as having a large stock of silver will be worth more as prices of goods will go down as more silver is siphoned out of the game. Almost all of these changes make it harder for newer players to "catch up" versus targeting changes that give the rich/ultra rich things that they would want to spend their silver on.

      I don't doubt these changes will siphon significantly more silver from the economy, but ultimately those people already have tons of money already stockpiled will benefit the most.
    • This was mentioned earlier but it is also no surprise gold has skyrocketed these past few months with many wealthy vets either breaking or quitting while throwing their wealth into gold first just in case. There are a few whales out there that can severely impact the market and may not ever even play again. You should work on a sink for that situation.
    • Vindrax wrote:

      Overall as an "upper middle class" player in this game, I stand to benefit significantly from these changes as having a large stock of silver will be worth more as prices of goods will go down as more silver is siphoned out of the game. Almost all of these changes make it harder for newer players to "catch up" versus targeting changes that give the rich/ultra rich things that they would want to spend their silver on.
      This is one of the points I agree with too here Vin. The proposed change really stands to just hurt newer players and those that are trying to buy premium purely through playing the game. The only real way to fix inflation is to create more Gold in the pool for these players to buy.

      Make new cash shop items that whenever they are purchased for real money it injects more gold into the market proportional to the value of the item bought. Right now players like myself who have enough silver to get by and have premium really do not have the incentive to spend real money on this game.

      The alternative is doing whats about to happen, which is starve the poor so it becomes even harder to buy up gold which either pushes them into buying gold via cash or quitting to go to a new game. I would wager they will quit the game which hurts all of us in the long run.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by DoomRawrus ().

    • Korn wrote:

      Hey there,

      thanks for all the feedback.

      A more general point: some of you have said that the planned changes will affect new players too strongly. We do not think that's the case, for the following reasons:
      • The biggest in-game expense for new players by far is the premium status. Measured in silver, at the price of almost 4400 silver per Gold that we saw before we announced the planned changes, that is 11m silver per month. Right now, purely as a result of the announcement of the planned changes, the gold price has dropped as low as 3600 - the difference for 1 months of premium here is equal to 2 million silver. Actual prices are always in flux, but it is extremely clear that the silver values we are talking about here are far more significant than the increase in repair costs or island upgrades, which are a one time expense. We don't know what the price of Gold will become once the changes actually go live, but there is a significant chance that they will go below the 3600 level that we have already seen.
      • For "rich" players, on the other hand, the monthly premium cost is not such a big factor. If, say, you earn 100m silver per month, it is not that relevant whether you pay 11m or 8m for your premium status. However, scaling sinks such as market fees/taxes, silver generated by the black market or optional sinks such as respec or transmutation can matter a great deal. And what will also matter is the impact the changes have or already had on gold savings.
      Having said that, one of the reasons that we posted the planned changes ahead of time was to collect feedback from the community, allowing us to fine tune them before they go live.

      Premium is the biggest in-game expense for free-to-play players. Your proposed changes may ease their burden, but only at the expense of those who are already paying money for premium (and they're more likely to be in-game poor than rich!).

      In short, these changes punish people for buying your product, and reward people for not buying it. Do you really think that will end well for you?
    • One way to add a good feature for guilds and also a good silver sink possibility to fight against gold price

      gmatagmis wrote:


      Create guild destiny tree with percs affecting all members with high progressive silver cost.


      Tree may contain some non-combat modifiers,
      like gathering/fishing speed bonus in certain biomes, on sertain Tiers of resources.
      Like minor crafting quality and speed bonuses split by all kinds of weapons and armors.
      Like super-minor and super-expencive season points multiplier.
      Damage and defense versus mobs, divided by mobs factions and tiers.
      Royal faction affiliation for minor royal points income.
      Royal affilation for HCE sigils income.
      Arena affilation for bages income.
      All during according activity.
      Royal reputation modifier.
      Outlaw duration reduction.
      All kinds of laborers happiness.
      Carry weight modifier.


      Tons of "useless shit" that became not so useless, when you have mo idea where you can spend accumulated wealth.
      An unique opportunity for rich players to spend their money at least somewhere.
      and i add my part for this

      Owlsane wrote:


      It might be the best solution for the situation if and only if it's some temporary buff for guild (like 1 week buff for example).

      Cuz otherwise we will get in the same situation as big guild will just max out stuff they want and situation will come back to ground 0 at some point.
      With this guild can capitalise on the temporary guild buff to for example make the new player progression faster / increase gathering / etc

      Also make it that reroll quality is a viable option otherwise this feature won't be used ever and that would be one silver sink option down. (making it viable by making it less pricey or better odds for quality increase can attract people thus more silver in the sink
    • Another way to strike this is swap acquiring silver from dropping it / black marketing it to actually getting stuff in the wild.

      Gathering is being progressively hit with the new changes, which is the main income from new players. Hard capping the resource prices is a bad move imo.


      Some suggestions:


      1. Using focus as a crafter shouldn't have a return rate, just a good upgrade to quality (15% -> increase 150 in quality, 44% -> 440 increase) would help dry resources from the system, making gathering more relevant. (I'm not a gatherer)



      2. Using focus as a refiner should enchant a percentage of it to the next enchant level. Maybe this will be the ONLY way to get a new .4 enchantment?
      This would be interesting as would add value to specialized refiners. While also making rarer resources more abundant. (Sinergizes perfectly with my 1. and 3. points)
      Since .4 enchantment may not be an actual option due to balancing (yet i think this would be amazing), refining .3 mats could just keep the return rate.



      3. Change the trash rate to be based on the ammount of assists up to a cap. This furthers improve removing resources from the market, adding more value to them and to gatherers. Also helps fight the N+1 situation.
      2.1. 10% per person that hit you in OW up to a 80% cap (Just decide the values, but i consider those optimal)
      2.2. 20% per person that hit you in Solo Dungeons, also capped at 80%. (Both situations favors solo gankers, as the actual trash rate is 30%, or so i read)


      4. As i stated in another post, removing silver bags / coins from RDG chests / OW chests, while raising the drop of rune/soul/relic/black.market.gear would also help migrating the silver from who has it to people that actually do stuff in the Open World.




      These also sinergy quite well with the yet to be announced (maybe next year?) resource random dungeons.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by ImaDoki: Added more ideas. ().

    • ImaDoki wrote:

      1. Using focus as a crafter shouldn't have a return rate, just a good upgrade to quality (15% -> increase 150 in quality, 44% -> 440 increase) would help dry resources from the system, making gathering more relevant. (I'm not a gatherer)



      2. Using focus as a refiner should enchant a percentage of it to the next enchant level. Maybe this will be the ONLY way to get a new .4 enchantment?
      This would be interesting as would add value to specialized refiners. While also making rarer resources more abundant. (Sinergizes perfectly with my 1. and 3. points)
      Since .4 enchantment may not be an actual option due to balancing (yet i think this would be amazing), refining .3 mats could just keep the return rate.

      I honestly wish focus didn't affect crafting/refining. :( The choice between watering crops and nurturing animals, and efficient refining/crafting feels strange, and also makes much of skill tree irrelevant.

      I'd rather the crafting/refining skill tree simply hard-improved your resource return without need for focus at all.

      (I note that the gathering and fighting skill trees are a lot more fun for me to climb, because their benefits are not tied to focus.)