Land Auction System Changes

    • Lol.

      Cost of defending plots goes up?

      Oh, say hello to the increased tax rates to cover that costs.

      All this will do is inflate the tax prices further, to make defending the plots at xx silver more reliable.

      Basically players will just band together even harder and raise taxes further to ensure they can profit even though auctions will be harder to defend.

      Big middle finger to the lil guys ^^;

      Also, you lil guys don't seem to understand the expense of running plots. Repairs, building investments, defense bids from players/or other shop owners trying to burn your profits and run you out, food expenses (if purchased) focus expense if you self craft food / farm, time investment in both farming and creating an associate list and networking. The politics of arguing with the new kid on the block for weeks every month because they continually undercut and drop prices, then having to throw bids at them aswell to push them out.

      Ya'll so miss informed it hurts.

      But mmm, yeah, big cartels with monopolies do make money. What's your problem with that? They've been playing for years and have been managing the above drama. They most likely sunk real money into the game to get to their current position, and its not like they even use the money - they are open world plebs who can't play for shit and are unreliable for guilds to host as they are self entitled snobs with no real in game friends, and used purely for their monetary value. I feel bad for them if anything.
    • Svander wrote:

      Lol.

      Cost of defending plots goes up?

      Oh, say hello to the increased tax rates to cover that costs.

      All this will do is inflate the tax prices further, to make defending the plots at xx silver more reliable.

      Basically players will just band together even harder and raise taxes further to ensure they can profit even though auctions will be harder to defend.

      Big middle finger to the lil guys ^^;

      Also, you lil guys don't seem to understand the expense of running plots. Repairs, building investments, defense bids from players/or other shop owners trying to burn your profits and run you out, food expenses (if purchased) focus expense if you self craft food / farm, time investment in both farming and creating an associate list and networking. The politics of arguing with the new kid on the block for weeks every month because they continually undercut and drop prices, then having to throw bids at them aswell to push them out.

      Ya'll so miss informed it hurts.

      But mmm, yeah, big cartels with monopolies do make money. What's your problem with that? They've been playing for years and have been managing the above drama. They most likely sunk real money into the game to get to their current position, and its not like they even use the money - they are open world plebs who can't play for shit and are unreliable for guilds to host as they are self entitled snobs with no real in game friends, and used purely for their monetary value. I feel bad for them if anything.
      You're absolutely right, that's not enough of a nerf on these monopoly holders. He admitted himself (the cartel), so we should also take away double bids for existing plot owners and fine these monopolies for 90% of their silver for ruining the game for the whole community. We have it right here folks, he said these nerfs aren't enough. Heard it strait from the cartel, they said they want more nerfs if we want to fix monopolies. Let's do it!

      The post was edited 1 time, last by thisismine ().

    • The plots issue is generated by the thought that be owner is cool, then exorbitant prices are paid for monthly exploitation rights of plots that are not worth them.


      The plot owner believes he has a castle, which he has to defend at all costs, when he really only has a temporary right of exploitation, he is simply rented. Like a crafter, stop making cleric robes if they are not profitable and look for another business, with the plots the same should happen ..



      Do a mafia, shoot prices, just create a current against and the consequence is these decisions, because for the devs it does not matter the game of 1% compared to 99% ... The image is everything.


      A good system to change this mentality would be to reset everything every 2-3 months and then whoever bets more takes the plot (without preferential treatment for anyone), multiply the available plots x5 and reduce return by 5-10%

      People must begin to understand that they are renting not buying, that paying certain amounts makes the business unfeasible
    • thisismine wrote:

      Svander wrote:



      Also, you lil guys don't seem to understand the expense of running plots.
      You're absolutely right, that's not enough of a nerf on these monopoly holders. He admitted himself (the cartel), so we should also take away double bids for existing plot owners and fine these monopolies for 90% of their silver for ruining the game for the whole community. We have it right here folks, he said these nerfs aren't enough. Heard it strait from the cartel, they said they want more nerfs if we want to fix monopolies. Let's do it!
      I'm not in a Cartel, and am a proud owner of 2 plots for about 2 months in the entirety of Albion. Not a 'lil guy' since I craft for profits. Plots are rather lame passive income even in comparison to a good labourer set up (of which I use 50 blacksmiths who make me more then plots daily easily.)

      Just pointing out ya'll have no information.
    • This is a change that should have been done months ago since the current one favors rich plot owners. Risk vs Reward makes it that you should risk what you bid and currently you risk very little by bidding extreamly high and having only to pay second highest bid value + 1 silver.

      I think the current values of the Caerleon plots are too over saturated, not reflecting the true value in the profit making. With the new change the profits of the plot owners will go down or the tax will go up making it so people might not bother crafting there. As this is a sandbox the market WILL correct it self like it does in the auction house system. Plot prices will drop, competition will come in to play with more owners if there isnt a cartel behind forcing the high taxes. This will take time, but it will happen.

      Most people defending the current system are plot owners and its understandable that they feel they are in danger of losing a very profitable way of making money (People who have owned the plots for very long time, same names). But like all things, this should involve risk and it comes in form of blind bid that you end up paying in total. Adapt or start doing something else to make the silver.
    • The biggest issue with this change and the comments in this thread is that handful of people aside, people simply don't understand how the city plot ownership works in this game.

      As @Bogul has already mentioned, you recently nerfed the amount of silver generated for the guild owning the city during auction day with regards to taxation.Now you have put in this change, which is a akin to putting a plaster on someone with a missing appendage, and then putting it on the wrong appendage. You have devalued the entire market overnight, and in the process of doing so have handed even more money to the guilds owning the cities, sure you nerfed the silver the guild gets back on auction day, but now you have put us into a position where taxes will be 40% + everywhere, in most cases 65% + because it is the only way to be able to defend your plots with any level of certainty.

      Not to mention you are still filling the pockets of the mega alliances by making the amount people have to bid much higher than before, so the money given back to the city owning guild in a nutshell, will likely be around the same figure as it was before you nerfed the silver they received. This is all without even mentioning that most mega alliances already give a % of the money invested in a plot back to the shopkeeper if they are in the same alliance. So the people owning and having to 'defend' plots will not be out of pocket as most of you believe.

      tl:dr - all you people thinking you now have a chance to snipe plots, please don't count on that. This is a change from the dark ages that favours mega alliances and shits on the little guy from a great height.

      Not impressed.

      Oh and for those of you saying use your island, you cannot compete competitively in the market if you do this, the 3+% swing is your profit margin gone.
      Pre Patch 16 UO Player - Casual PK/Carebear Crafter - Now Old.
    • Vasort wrote:

      U need to read other topic I told 3 days ago i will start bidding all cartels and i will also win that content because this content already end for me i did +100 billion silver already

      with This system its gonna be soooo easy for me

      even if i wont bid anyone They will lose silver

      After 15th september You cant find any shop owner in this game BECAUSE all of them gonna lose silver

      So Are u gonna be Shop Owner
      }
      TELL ME WHO WILL BUY SHOPS

      so Retard Players Will cry again

      MAKE SHOPS NPC

      BECAUSE OF THAT

      when making decisions like this again

      Don't think of them in the toilet

      sit down, meet, you can find the right result of the discussion more beautiful this way
      Looks like you are the one crying on the forum. No one cares about your 100 Billion.
      You are welcome to do what ever you want with your silver. Btw never go full retard.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by arifur ().

    • Well. Can u make more changed then? Because if Cartel goes down, there will be chaos in any town and 8% fees with zero profit on plots. Is it good for all players? Dont think so. Some players will loose their content. I will not play this shit with noobs who cant count profit and with 8% taxes.

      It is necessary to make changes that will not allow foolishly put low taxes.
    • Saya wrote:

      this is not how to fix monopolies, nor is it how you fix plot ownership issues

      please go back and read the posts by BananaPudding and myself in the round table archive from a year ago
      @Saya

      Care to share that information here, I would be interested to see the input of yourself and BP.


      I tend to agree though, I do not think this is a workable solution long term to the root causes of the Cartel, OR a workable solution to empowering the community at large with the information necessary to balance this market.

      I have repeatedly suggested that SBI make reasonable design changes to eliminate the currently intentionally designed ambiguity in the plot ownership economics.

      - Leaving the bid history available permanently for all plots in a log
      - Logging the nutrition supplied to the stations
      - Logging the associate usage (with taxes (% AND total item value) and nutrition consumption
      - Logging the Public usage (with taxes (% AND total item value) and nutrition consumption

      With these simple changes the community could correctly place a valuation and judge the overall utilization of various stations over time.

      With proper understanding of the Parity values of the plots, 80 % of the Chatter and Propaganda would be immediately eliminated.

      ....

      Lets take a look at the three recent changes SBI has implemented in response to the Cartel's emerging (And Saya's and BanannaPudding's departure)

      1. Introduction of Blind Auction
      2. Reduction in share of cumulative Auction income to City Owner over the cycle from 25% to 10%
      3. The current change in this post of taking the total value of the Winning Bid (Either from Plot owner or External Bidder)

      ...

      None of these three factors addresses the inherently designed Ambiguity of the economics of this crucial and major element of this game.

      The community at large has no idea how much the City Owner collects each day from their share of the auctions (Even more ambiguous now because this post does not state weather the 10% will be of the BID or of the TOTAL COLLECTED)

      The community at large has no idea what guilds or crafters are using the various plots and at what tax ratios (This allows Cartels to hide behind alts and bolsters their ability to perpetuate propaganda)

      The community at large has no real data on what the various plots consume in nutrition each month.

      The community at large has no real data on the utilization and income of the various plots each month.

      The formulas for Nutrition/Nutrition Utilization relative to Item Value are complex, not uniform or linear to market value of resources, and not clearly made available to the community at large.

      As such... the only current way to get this information is to dive into plot ownership with Complete Ignorance.

      As plot values continue to rise in both Silver Terms and Gold Terms, and as the existing formulas for Nutrition Utilization, relative to Item Value, relative to Market Value (in silver), relative to Market Value (in gold) continue to shift as the community grows and the value of Gold increases; the strategy to profit from plot ownership becomes skewed.

      ...

      When it comes down to it Vasort and I have a similar goal in some ways.

      I see Vasort's goal as extracting as much profit out of the plot ownership through Cartel Management in Caerleon as he can before driving the majority of crafters to other avenues (Island, Black Zone, Other City) ... While simultaneously increasingly justifying larger bids to feed the city owner maximum daily return for the control of Caerleon (which is shared with Vasort). He sustains this by ensuring that all of the plot owners profit.

      My goal is the same, but where Vasort attempts to maximize... I attempt to minimize.

      I envision an Anti-Cartel who would minimize plot values and charge just slightly over nutrition costs for the utilization of crafting stations. I don't give a shit what the City Owner makes each day from Controlling Caerleon because I don't want or expect a piece of it. I want all the plot owners to make just enough to be sustainable and offer the crafters the maximum return from the City Bonus.

      The truth is... it is much harder to maintain my vision of the Anti-Cartel than Vasorts current cartel dynamics because in the pool of great Ambiguity that the designers have created and continue to feed Maximizing to the Ceiling (Which Vasort has done with 90%) taxes is much easier than Minimizing while remaining sustainable.

      ...

      At this point... I am pretty discouraged... I agree with Vasort... With this change they have added yet another layer of ambiguity without adding any element of needed transparency.

      The portion of the community that controls more wealth and benefits from the MAXIMIZATION CARTEL DYNAMICS (High Taxes, Higher and Increasing Plot Values, Increasing Share of City Ownership) will benefit and the rest of the community will continue to be left to struggle.

      That SBI reduced the City Owner share from 25% to 10% just slightly before this current change of Blind top end auction bid signals to me that SBI knows and intends this to be the evolving dynamic.

      As plot values increase 150% or more the City Owner will in Silver Terms maintain the same daily income as before.

      ...

      In conclusion... I am discouraged and will step back to observe...

      Congratulations Vasort.

      Congratulations Blue Army.

      Congratulations Money Guild.

      you have divided the City Plot section of the sandbox between you successfully.

      The post was edited 2 times, last by VOC ().

    • emutheblue wrote:

      As a small shop owner in a non-zerg alliance, this is pretty much GG.
      How do you maintain your non-zerg status? Do you agree to never have 10+ people in the same zone? Maybe you guys are spread out really well to avoid any potential to blobbing or have fewer than 10 people in the alliance. I'm interested to know because my allies can never spread out well enough to not zerg.
    • Let's face the fact, plots are not working as intended.
      We have broken Albion Online world, where plots belong to the mafia, who collects tribute from the population.
      In my opinion, in ideal Albion Online world, plots should belong to crafters and serve their focus emission advantage in exchange for the need for plot maintenance.
      Good job SBI. Free market should be free. Burst this bubble.
      WTB skill