Items Due For A Balance Pass: Make Unused Weapons Fun Again!

    • Items Due For A Balance Pass: Make Unused Weapons Fun Again!

      There are a number of items in this game that currently go under-utilized and are outperformed by other more-effective weapons, essentially rendering these items obsolete, this is a list of what I believe to need a nice polish.


      Hoarfrost Staff: Avalanche: It launches a slow moving snowball and freezes the enemies it hits

      Whats wrong with it: Due to economic factors permafrost prism massively outclasses it due to its no requiring a straight line of sight for targeting and being a near instant "point and freeze" instead of "roll and pray".

      How to improve it: A range increase to begin, but instead of rolling, along the line with the shatter ability it should drop in a straight line from above along the lines of the royal helmet (this is not a call for a permafrost nerf) and a slight damage buff (7-15%) to go with it. By making it like the royal helmet it preserves the dodging aspect while still increasing overall application.


      Wildfire Staff: Magma Sphere: A bowling ball of magma does damage to enemies in a straight line additionally inflicting a small burn DOT

      Whats Wrong With It: With what I suspect to have been re-using the bowling ball code from the Hoarfrost staff it suffers the same application limitations in this meta to make itself effective, its outclassed by the wailing bow which can fire across corners and again due to economic factors, is equally viable in zvz conditions and is outclassed by the brimstone's finishing potiential and the wailing bows wall ignoring penetration and range.

      How to Improve it: Making this weapon an instant cast will give it the split second "turnaround" weapon to aid a successful push or counterpush, additionally much like the Malevolent locus making this skill non-interruptable while casting akin to the Locus will give it a decisive niche in all types of engagements allowing definitive application of damage, to balance don't change the bowling mechanic but do increase the balls move speed 2x to improve application. Note, this weapon will need a moment of stand time to balance it, like when you're casting Halberd 'E' and you pause for a second, no running while bowling.


      Pike: Rooting Smash: Roots an enemy within 4m and deals damage according to the number of spear charges it has.

      Whats Wrong With It: Correct me if I am wrong but I play this game a decent amount and I cannot recall the last time I have ever seen a pike in combat. The 1- Handed spear has comparable damage and an offhand option while the pike has a root, which is cleanse-able. It isn't enough to compete with the other spears in the Meta at the moment and unless SBI is pulling the meta from under the carpet soon it needs a change.

      How to improve it: A spear is a long range melee weapon, its 4m range is abysmal, hell the Halberd has a 7m range on its 'E'. Considering this weapons place as a single target weapon I'd like to preserve it in that niche. For those familiar the weapon Death Givers instantly resets its E if it has the appropriate number of stacks on the weapon. Adding this feature to this weapon would give it a unique place within the small gang meta scene as it would allow a minimal downtime engagement composition where you aren't sitting around waiting for your next skill to follow up on a combo. I believe this would be balanced as it still lacks major mobility with the exception of the 'W' but that would result in forsaking the forest of spears and potentially resetting your spear stacks. Additionally this weapon would be a mana hog due to attempting to re-stack too quickly so that would be another balancing factor.


      Crossbow: Snipe Shot: A single target high damage skill that tracks its victim and pop's em clean through the eyes with a bolt

      Whats Wrong With It: Due to the move speed changes standard walk speed and mounts that were previously unable to evade its range are now able to do so reducing its place in the meta. For example from standing in the same position, attempting to shoot a Direwolf that starts running away from your exact position will escape the targeting range of the skill off-screen and not fire. Additionally invisibility and other invulnerability skills are common in this meta resulting in this weapon being less than utilized.

      How To Improve It: First changing the cast speed from 2.5 seconds to 1.5 would make its viability immediately more appealing in any scenario, crossbows already got decent 'Q' and 'W' buffs but I believe a unique feature of invisibility nullification would make this weapon stand alone. In particular enemies would be unable to become invisible while targeted by the weapon ensuring the connection of the shot. This preserves the invulnerability tactics of cleric robe and soldier helmets while hampering the pseudo invulnerability of invisibility. In order to maintain its balance not touching its vulnerability to interrupts or stuns would be sufficient and Knight Helmets would deal with the issue of Knockback interrupts as a gear complement.


      Tomb Hammer: Grasp Of The Undead: An undead hand comes out of the ground damaging and stunning enemies.

      Whats Wrong With It: With the mobility and the stunning capacity of the Grovekeeper with putting yourself in the enemies back lines or pursuing targets, the great hammer as a budget Grovekeeper and then you are presented with a ranged weapon that is both less effective and has less mobility, you wouldn't even give it a second thought. Sure the range is good but its essentially a ray of light occupying an 'E'. Maybe retro thought that "Oh maybe someone could combine this with Power Geyser and do a target hammer trick" well no that's just not happening, at least not in the real world.

      How to improve it: When I hear "Grasp of the Undead" I think I'm grabbing this guy, but all I am doing is stunning him from range, the thing with this is that it is cleanseable and therefore wasted. An interesting mechanic I've considered with it is that you are transported to the location of the stunned enemies bypassing wind walls and other CC, a sort of "diving into the ground and popping back up" sort of thing (doesn't need a fancy animation). This would enable offensive tanks to penetrate enemy backlines and get on top of their targets, this means that its double edged as well due to forcing you to teleport to their position.
      What happens once their are on top of their stunned targets is entirely the choice of the tank but adding a form of mobility to this weapon akin to Hellion shoes would give it some interesting tactical options.


      Battleaxe: Vampiric Strike: Depending on the number of stacks of Rending strike the target has on them you heal that much.

      Whats wrong with this weapon: Obviously designed for a small gang engagement the scaling for the Rending strikes and Vampiric strikes means maintaining close range with your target. This is prohibitive in the small group encounters due to mobility and interrupts often causing the stacks to lapse. This results in the non-utilization of its unique Vampirc skill E. To utilize this to its maximum potential means getting 3 'Q's off and then your 'E' while engaging the opponent. Additionally due to the HP buffs the % effectiveness of its self healing was reduced.

      How To Improve It: Giving the Q a 5% slow per stack would give the weapon the ability to close the distance it needs due to the melee range of its 'Q', due to deadly chop sundering the damage should be enough but increasing the healing amounts by 20% of their previous values should be in line with the increased base health changes, but we don't want to end up with undying self healing vampire axe men running around all the time so having the 3rd stack be only increased by 15% of its previous value should be enough for experimentation, if needed the numbers on the healing values can be increased until the weapon is deemed "not shit" anymore.


      That's all I've got for now, I took ease of development into account for this so I didn't suggest any radical new mechanics (except the snipe one) that would take too much development, recycling what we already know they have the code for hopefully would be good to get some of these weapons out of the gutter.
      -Humbly, your renegade Ox Rider
    • The crossbow snipe ability is devastating as it is with the powerful Q to boot, reducing the speed of the cast will of course make the crossbow seen a lot more but the damage it pumps out would need to be toned down a bit.

      I watched a guy get sniped straight off his lizard mount with one cast. He was silly for staying in range but it devastated him.

      Imagine gank squads of 5 snipes. You wouldnt stand a chance. 2 snipes aiming at your mount to get you off then a triple snipe to the face.

      Worse than dying to 5 lots of scrub tier 4.1 claws.
    • I would advise buffing the CC component of the Pike's E.

      Edit: Specifically, because it doesn't make sense to have a root effect on a melee weapon (especially if it's a ST root). A stun, perhaps, but not a root.

      Samashaus wrote:

      Imagine gank squads of 5 snipes. You wouldnt stand a chance. 2 snipes aiming at your mount to get you off then a triple snipe to the face.

      How is that any different from 5 warbows blowing up a single target with W+E?
      Fusionbomb - GM of Morbidly_Obese

      T8 Axe/Sickle/Pickaxe/Skinning/Stone
      T7 Fishing

      400 Holy Spec

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Fusionbomb ().

    • I haven't a clue how it's different but if you want to elaborate, please do.
      5 stacking powerful weapons and buffing them up further offers no counter play, that's my issue with meta builds and FOTM weapons being used by gank squads.

      I'm all for rebalancing to get ignored weapons back into the fold but buffing the items too much just creates a different problem


      Buff every weapon to uber levels and I'm sure we'd still see the same handful for the meta so I'm at a loss.
    • But xbow cast time take ages to be fired and its not that hard to do something about that (like using meta hunter hood - which do more dmg to sniper then target).

      Owlsane wrote:

      (...)(which some can't do it event when near the target)(...)
      Ive seen many attemts from others and myself - cute to see this misses.
      However I belive that is harder to hit close ranged target then one which is far xD
      Display Spoiler
      but if someone fire it in opposite direction... xD

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Qolkkalom ().