Simple map re-design suggestion

    • Simple map re-design suggestion

      I know this topic has been discussed to death, but given the new conversations about Alliances and this realization by SBI:

      Retroman wrote:

      Alliance armies are too mobile. An Alliance can spontanously accumulate all online members fast at any spot of the world. They are not regionally bound in any sense. Making it hard to have smaller skirmishes, because battles easily escalate in numbers, due to reinforcements getting there very fast.
      I'd like to open a discussion about how the world map should be re-designed.

      My impression is SBI introduced the realmgate to (1) reduce griefing at zone entrances and (2) make it easier to find PvP within the blackzone.

      I think (1) isn't so big of a problem with the current game population and zoning mechanics. The bubble lets you get pretty far and there doesn't seem to be an issue when leaving Caerleon in the red zones.

      Maybe (2) will be a problem, but I know a lot of people expected the world of Albion to feel big and with the realmgate as it currently is, the world feels really small. I think this is a necessary change to restore how the world should feel and make gameplay more localized. There will just need to be incentives for people to gather in certain locations to cause conflict and PvP.

      Please correct me if I am missing a strong reason to keep the realmgate!


      Here are my proposed changes:
      - Via boat connect: Lymhurst to Roostcliff, Bridgewatch to Browngrass Meadow, Martlock to Blencathra, Thetford to a new zone south of and connecting to Logjam Fen, Fort Sterling to a new zone north of and connecting to Pen Castell
      - Add a new zone connecting Browngrass and Caerleon so Bridgewatch gets a shorter route to Caerleon in return for being further form the rest of the blackzone
      - Turn No Respite into a new black zone city
      - Connect the realmgate in Caerleon to this new city, but remove all other connections. (So Caerleon will be connected to the black zone still through a new city in no respite)
      - Replace No Respite with Caerleon.
      - In Caerleon's old location add a new Heretic World Boss. In this zone add a tunnel connection to the underway so it connects to Caerleon which is now in Anglia. This allows red zone Outlaws to still get to Caerleon and the blackzones.
      - Add a 'hideout' underneath each World Boss zone in the blackzone. Connect them via tunnels to the outer edge of the four surrounding zones (for Blighted Bog this hideout would connect to Flesheater Morass, Deathmarch Expanse, Bleak Moor, and Bein Aden). These zones would have no crafting stations, but be a small social area with a respawn and bank.
      - Turn Carpet of Bones OR Circling Vultures into an Inis Mon style World Boss so we have 2 of each world boss types instead of 1, 2, and 4.
      - Limit guilds to one town plot each. (I know guilds can abuse this by creating alt guilds to sit on town plots... but I still think this additional inconvenience is necessary)
      - Add something special to the old portal zones in Eastern Anglia, Cumbria, and Mercia so those zones don't feel so empty. 20v20 or 10v10 hellgate spawns?

      (credit for map goes to u/FullbordadOG - reddit.com/r/albiononline/comm…world_map_of_albion_v_20/)

      The post was edited 3 times, last by Lanyday: Edited with input from conversation below ().

    • Please note: I don't expect this to solve the issues with alliances. I think the map feeling too small is a separate issue that a lot of people have noticed and complained about. I'm just hoping that the recent conversations have shed some more light on this issue so the devs will notice it and make some simple changes.
    • that was a round table suggestion iirc. I think it was terrible. sandbox game but devs forced a hub city and also seen as a solution to zerg guilds using the Quays for quick continent switching. Which was an issue at the time. but they could have done some less drastic changes then totally abandoning Quays and BZ towns. There’s no oasis in BZ for unguilded, small alliance, or pple who own 0 terri.
    • Remove the realm gate. Add a bridge from Swamp Cross to Slickhag. Add a bridge from Mountain Landing to Dun Medd. Add a boat from Highland Landing to Blencathra. Add a boat from Forest Landing to Cley Hill.

      Allow suicide to take you to nearest City, Caerleon, Nearest Guild Terry, Home Plot or Home.

      Caerleon becomes the focal point of the royals, and the other Cities matter and become the focus of the Outlands.
    • i agree they should re-implement some sort of blackzone town/tavern/compound something thats deep in blackzones and serves as an oasis for everyone. something small in size maybe castle sized i dont think it actually needs to be a full fledged town with crafting stations but maybe solo BZ players from back in the day would disagree. it needs to be unique and have character its a spot where fame farmers, gatherers, gankers might come to for a break. imo it shouldnt be connected to caerleon. there should be 2 in anglia, 1 cumbria, 1 mercia but it should exist within the zone as an element not a total zone replacement. and probably should have an option to "sneak out" of the town. IE some sort of invis alternative to the zone bubble so that groups can leave without being trailed. this was a common suggestion for normal zone bubbles and im pretty sure is how eve handles zone bubbles. prolly a penalty to the invis user if they willingly break it like a CD. in fact having a close safe haven seems like a good way to help the current ganking meta where even with a direwolf youre likely to die if chased by a dire group for 4 zones to a portal. the chase could only go 2.5 zones(assuming bz town is in the raidzone). its kinda like the top of mountain lodge at ski resorts or some shit. i think itd be a cool social spot as well

      addin ports back will never happen just because of the investments that have been poured into Caerleon, i guess maybe thats where connecting the bz town to caerleon comes in. then youd still have the hub issue.
      But ports would change so much. so many things would have to readjusted. i cant even really list all of the things this would effect. pple might actually live in the BZ again. most guilds townplots are empty.

      limiting townplots to one, idk i really have no feelings on this one. one townplot can hold every crafting/refining bldg u need so guilds dont technically need it but its a reward of conquest too, used as a gift in diplomacy and to entice guilds into your alliance tho most guilds dont do this. TC gave away 2 of their townplots to Guilds (Grey & FrogueOne) who joined our alliance knowing eventually they might leave. but how would you handle the loss of a townplot? Example: Guild A GvGs and takes Guild Bs townplot. what happens if you can only have 1 townplot?

      The post was edited 1 time, last by owensssss ().

    • @owensssss I really like your hideout idea. I think putting these little safe spots directly in a world boss zone would make the world boss zones a little too safe. Instead, I think they should be "underneath" the world boss zone and have it's entrances appear like tunnel entrances in the 4 zones surrounding the world boss zone. Ideally the entrance will be far from the zone line to the world boss (but closer to the other exit). They could move the warcamp in each world boss zone into this little safe zone so it acts as a social spot and a small bank (but has no crafting stations). Maybe you could even launch from here on Caerleon with the idea being this hideout is 'rebelling'. I don't think people really ZvZ for these warcamps anymore do they? You should also allow players to bind themselves here.

      Your point about Caerleon is really good and I think I'd like to change that suggestion. Instead, Caerleon should completely replace No Respite. They don't have to change Caerleon at all but have it just completely replace no respite and maybe change or remove the underway. Where Caerleon used to be they can add a new world boss zone... maybe a heretic themed one since we don't have one of those. It could be thematic too... the heretics took over Caerleon and the outlaws in Caerleon took over the castle in No Respite.

      The only issue with this is there needs to be a city for 'outlaws' in the red zone. I think they could add a tunnel in the new heretic world boss zone that replaces Caerleon and connects through the underway to Caerleon. This way you can run through blackzones to the ports to get from Caerleon to the outer cities or you can run through red zones like you normally do.

      In this way, West Anglia becomes somewhat similar in layout to the current royal continent. The outer cities would suddenly be just as close to the blackzone as Caerleon and East Anglia through Mercia would be increasingly more dangerous. The world would feel bigger.

      I think one of the huge benefits of this layout is that while Cumbria and Mercia have higher enchantment rates and season points they are also significantly further away from Caerleon. This stops huge zergs from moving quickly through Cumbria and Mercia and also makes them much more dangerous... like they should be. It encourages players to actually live out in the blackzone and brings huge value back to town plots in Cumbria and Mercia. Players without town plots can use the 'hideouts' under the world boss zones as a place to rest, keep their gear, and respawn. But they'll still have to make frequent trade runs to bring gear and supplies out to these hideouts because they can't be crafted there.

      I don't think this would hurt anyone's 'investments' in Caerleon, but only make it viable to live out of the other royal cities.
    • @LuricWelter I think there are three issues with your suggestions.

      (1) running from Martlock to Highland Landing just to get to the blackzone will be really annoying and I don’t think it is necessary. The cities should connect directly to the “harbor”.

      (2) all of the royal cities need to port to the same continent. I think it makes the most sense for this to be Anglia because it balances resource enchantment with distance from the cities. If they don’t port to the same continent this means people could abuse fast travel between royal cities to move quickly within the blackzone like they do now using the realmgate and it makes the royal cities very unequal if one can go to Merica and the other can’t.

      (3) Caerleon needs to connect to the blackzone somehow or 90% of the population will be mad they settled there and the red zone “outlaws” will have no way of getting to the blackzone. This is one change I just don’t think could be forced on the players this late. It is also pretty important the black market isn’t that far away from everything.
    • @owensssss As for the town plot restriction... I’m not super tied to this because I think it is easily abusable by an alt guild anyway. However, I think it would be a needed deterant from the SUN strategy of owning half the town plots and selling them when they feel like it. Ideally, guilds could be pushed back to their town plot by a rival guild but wouldn’t be pushed completely out unless a new guild challenges them.
    • Remove Caerleon world portal.

      Reinstitute boat docks from royal cities to parts of the BZ.

      Have 3 BZ cities, one in Anglia, one in Cumbria, one in Mercia.

      Control for the cities would be fought over every 2 months via 20v20 through some means of qualifying for the fight, limit one per alliance.

      Make craftable Taverns, Churches, and other new types of buildings with functions to improve socializing and QOL when not fighting.

      Allow more build-ing related options for townplots and BZ-cities.


      For example, after winning a BZ town, that guild can build in a semi-permanent area of that town with customizable buildings and designs. This would allow stone-industry to sell more products, and builders to make new types of buildings. Perhaps even this would be the "siege-able" area of the BZ. So the BZ towns could be fought and won also based on the ability of a guild to design its castle and portion/fraction of the town.
    • @Theat I think keeping one blackzone city where No Respite is now (just move Caerleon) would mean guild town plots out in Mercia would be very valuable. The hideouts could act as bases for people who don't have a town plot out there, but they'd have to transport gear out frequently.

      I made a map with some of the ideas discussed above :)

      Credit for base map to u/FullbordadOG - reddit.com/r/albiononline/comm…world_map_of_albion_v_20/)

    • Lanyday wrote:

      @Theat I think keeping one blackzone city where No Respite is now (just move Caerleon) would mean guild town plots out in Mercia would be very valuable. The hideouts could act as bases for people who don't have a town plot out there, but they'd have to transport gear out frequently.

      I made a map with some of the ideas discussed above :)

      Credit for base map to u/FullbordadOG - reddit.com/r/albiononline/comm…world_map_of_albion_v_20/)


      Looks great
    • I made a few changes to equalize the royal zones in terms of travel:
      - Thetford harbor is moved to a new zone that connects to Logjam Fen (mirroring the original Fort Sterling suggestion)
      - A new zone should be added between browngrass and Caerleon to connect bridgewatch closer to Caerleon.

      In this way, Bridgewatch is further from the rest of the blackzone but has the shortest travel distance to Caerleon through Anglia (still two full zones which is still a more dangerous journey than Fort Sterling to Caerleon in the red zone today). The other four royal cities have 3 blackzones to travel through before getting to Caerleon. Bridgewatch, Lymhurst, and Martlock all connect to an old portal zone that has two blackzone exits. Fort Sterling and Thetford are slightly closer to the rest of the blackzone but their harbor zone only has one exit making them a little more dangerous. I hope this creates reasonable tradeoffs for the five royal cities.

    • @Gank That looks pretty cool too!

      I was trying to keep my suggestions to something that wouldn't completely overhaul the map so it would be easy-ish to implement and wouldn't require like a wipe or something.

      Was this from a beta or something you came up with recently?

      Do you only have attacks paths going from warcamps to territories because you want to remove territory to territory attacks?


    • This is so dump because everybody who has a skull (under -1000 Reputation) cant go to the other portals than Caerleon this is only good for gatherers and for people that like to gank or fight this isnt good.. And the other bad point about this is that you can zone after them if they go in because you will know where they go..
    • The problem with these "immersive" or "deep" maps is that when a guild gets territories far away from the entrances, they're too safe.

      In one of the betas we had a map where you had to run all the way from safe zones to the black zones.

      If a guild happened to be able to get some of the territories furthest away from the city, they could keep them for months uncontested. Because they were too easy to defend.

      So if we want such a map, we need to take account of that. Either by implementing a new way to launch attacks directly into the "end zones" or some other mechanic.
      https://forum.albiononline.com/index.php/Thread/82954-Guide-What-order-to-level-items-in-to-get-the-most-specialization-for-your-time/